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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The BBC is promoting a trans doctor who seemingly only affirms patients' dysphoria

102 replies

jadefinch · 28/02/2020 13:48

BBC Three has created a film, made a Twitter thread and put together a website promoting 'Dr Ronx', a trans doctor who seems to affirm patients with severe problems' gender identity issues rather than offer independent and potentially helpful advice.

In the footage shown here a young patient says their chest binder is causing them severe spinal pain and breathing difficulties. Dr Ronx offers the advice to keep using chest binders but try different ones.

At no point is it even suggested that the patient could have counselling so they can stop hating their body, or that the spinal, rib and breathing problems are serious issues.

What is the BBC playing at?

twitter.com/bbcthree/status/1233180011487612928

The thread ends with a link to websites such as Mermaids for children to contact if they have issues:

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/5zvRZW3yRHjqczdwd0gv3S0/information-and-support-gender-identity

OP posts:
PermanentTemporary · 29/02/2020 23:39

I can imagine that doctors get objectified for their body parts, like other people do. But that's a really odd comment about people looking for breasts and then looking for penis.

I couldn't post on twitter about this as I was so, so angry it would have been incoherent. And I wondered about the harm minimisation argument. But watching a girl being taught how to bind more effectively made me feel absolutely homicidal. And I thought about black women of the past who have been enslaved and kept down and suffered from misogynoir and made to want to spend hours and fortunes getting their natural hair changed to look more 'caucasian' and had sexist and racist comments made about them whether they do or they don't and I just wanted to cry that this woman felt the best medical care she could offer that child was to crush her breasts more effectively.

NotTerfNorCis · 01/03/2020 00:25

The BBC is starting to report more on detransitioners. Finally they're recognising that genderism isn't a force for good.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51676020

A 23-year-old woman who is taking legal action against an NHS gender clinic says she should have been challenged more by medical staff over her decision to transition to a male as a teenager.

Lawyers will argue children cannot give informed consent to treatment delaying puberty or helping them to transition.

Keira describes being a tomboy as a child. When asked how strongly she felt the need to change her gender identity, she replied that it gradually built up as she found out more about transitioning online.

Then as she went down the medical route, she said "one step led to another".

She decided to stop taking cross-sex hormones last year and said she was now accepting of her sex as a female. But she was also angry about what had happened to her in the last decade.

"I was allowed to run with this idea that I had, almost like a fantasy, as a teenager.... and it has affected me in the long run as an adult.

ChattyLion · 01/03/2020 09:47

The case brought by the unbelievably brave and public-spirited Keira Bell Flowers (and the understandably anonymous mother of another child bringing the case with her Flowers) who have together got an ongoing judicial review going of NHS GIDS policy around medical ‘treatment’ of children with gender dysphoria, distress or confusion should absolutely be putting the wind right up the BBC.

Breast binding = self harm, self-physical-limitation from normal healthy function and exertion. Breast binding is self-hatred and severe distress acted out brutally (only) on the female body. It’s nothing like wearing a minimising bra or sports bra because you want a different look under a T-shirt, for fucks sake. The way they describe it is so trivialised, it’s a risky and dangerous thing.

I’m sick of hearing about how the establishment is writing off kids in distress and not paying for psychological support through CAMHS. How they are actually supporting the indoctrination and harmful treatment of kids being openly pushed for by a powerful political machine advancing men’s sexual rights and selling snake oil fantasy with one hand, and making the threat of ostracism for wrong-think with the other.

When have making permanent physical damage to a child or young person’s body ever been a genuine, lasting cure for their distress, confusion, anxiety, delusion, fantasy, their response to trauma or to grooming, or to them just wanting to fit in or the fact that they understandably wishing that the world didn’t enforce sexualisation and rigid, reductive, life-confining pink or blue expectations on to them?

The way the concerns about all this has been ignored by the media in general and their rainbow-washed positive presentation of medical interventions and breast binding show they have learnt nothing from all of those recent child sexual abuse scandals, or from Savile. It’s not just the media at fault here, but they are certainly complicit.

Women have been saying to the BBC for years now that they must ask questions and we just get waved away. We have written to our MPs about this and they haven’t set up any parliamentary enquiry either.

The fact that it’s individuals who have been harmed by all this, like Keira, having to go public to challenge this in the face of an actively indifferent and hostile establishment makes me respect her even more for bringing this case, though I do feel she should not be having to do this. This is society’s problem of safeguarding, it is not about individuals.

The BBC have been not only uncritically cheerleading genderist politics for years but also making it very easy for #nodebate figureheads to avoid talking about any of the possible down sides and to avoid speaking about all of the massive unknowns.

That has been a huge failure of journalistic standards. I’m not a journalist but #nodebate should be a massively suspicious red flag to anyone with any vestige of common sense.

Small pockets of BBC output- with a particularly honourable mention to Newsnight’s Deborah Cohen and Hannah Barnes www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-49036145
and also to Emily Maitliss for objective interviewing on Newsnight, and to Justin Webb for asking reasonable questions on radio 4 Today prog, have all been noted on here and praised for upholding journalistic integrity. I think they have been starting to break down the uncritical stance at the BBC. The article today on Keira Bell written by Alison Holt, Social affairs news correspondent is objective. www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51676020

However, I think that the BBC and the media altogether needs an enquiry on how they have been presenting these issues, how they have been reporting on ‘trans children’ (a completely political category that encourages separate treatment with lesser safeguarding and affirmative treatment with a lack of medical evidence).

New, professional objectivity-assuring reporting guidelines need to be urgently drawn up for the media as a whole on this whole area.

SunkissesBringBackLangCleg · 01/03/2020 10:04

This story about a CBBC 'Operation Ouch' presenter promoting self-harming has got in the Sunday Times today: www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/bbc-criticised-over-breast-binding-of-trans-patient-0zwqfm6sk

SunkissesBringBackLangCleg · 01/03/2020 10:06

@ChattyLion Fair Play for Women wrote a superb guide for the media on how they should be reporting this issue: fairplayforwomen.com/media_guide/

Cwenthryth · 01/03/2020 10:55

In The Times today

BBC criticised over breast-binding of trans patient

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a233905e-5aef-11ea-b224-188b67cae9b1?shareToken=52033a274e6717ed1c7e702433717887

ChattyLion · 01/03/2020 11:00

Thanks Sunkisses. It’s a very good explainer and thanks for pointing it out. However it doesn’t have any professional body enforcement power behind it- it needs to be adopted by media organisations or in the BBC case, adopted by BBC editorial guidelines which they then have to stick to.

Also it doesn’t cover issues around coverage of children, or coverage aimed at children specifically- like the constant references to ‘transgender children’ which are deeply contentious as a description.
We would never usually put adult political descriptors on to children. Why ok to do that to gender non conforming children?- but is often stated as if a neutral and factual label by journalists. Or as we see here with breast binding, irresponsible reporting.

No criticism of FPW- it’s a really useful guide which all journalists should read.

NotBadConsidering · 01/03/2020 11:09

From the article:

The BBC said Frankie had made clear his gender dysphoria was causing depression and anxiety and that wearing a binder could improve his mental health and allow him to express his identity without damaging his health. “Dr Ronx’s proper role is therefore to respect that choice, while offering medical advice on how to do it in the right way.”

Now try:

The BBC said Frankie had made clear his anorexia was causing depression and anxiety and that eating less could improve his mental health and allow him to express his slim body without damaging his health. “Dr Ronx’s proper role is therefore to respect that choice, while offering medical advice on how to do it in the right way.”

What’s the difference? It’s no different to a doctor keeping a patient’s BMI low enough to keep them happy, but not so low they get electrolyte disturbance and haemodynamic instability. Show them how to do it in the right way yeah?

Haworthia · 01/03/2020 11:11

It’s on the BBC news front page today too.

www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/article/81739645-a301-42fb-88f3-58fb0685bd60

"By law you can go to your GP, you can say, 'Look, I identify as he, I feel [like a] he, I am binding, I'm navigating my life, I’m using 'he' pronouns, I'm living as a male' - and therefore you want to be referred to a Gender Identity Clinic. Just ask for that referral

ChattyLion · 01/03/2020 11:42

Also if the BBC at the end of this film have a list of resources, why are they only pointing to GIRES and mermaids and co- why not to transgender trend and other GC resources for parents? That’s not balance!

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/5zvRZW3yRHjqczdwd0gv3S0/information-and-support-gender-identity

FrogsFrogs · 01/03/2020 12:06

From the times

'The BBC said Frankie had made clear his gender dysphoria was causing depression and anxiety and that wearing a binder could improve his mental health and allow him to express his identity without damaging his health. “Dr Ronx’s proper role is therefore to respect that choice, while offering medical advice on how to do it in the right way.”'

No other options
Breast binding is the only way

Wow

FrogsFrogs · 01/03/2020 12:09

The normal response to a child who was doing something to themselves that caused them pain, injury, inability to breathe properly would be

Oh god that's terrible what are you doing to yourself let me help you

Not oh yes crack on. Ha ha your tits are big aren't they. Yeah no way can you go out with those, just use a slightly larger one and it'll still hurt, and damage your body, and restrict your breathing, but just quite so much.

FrogsFrogs · 01/03/2020 12:14

'By demonstrating on Frankie's girlfriend, Dr Ronx presents Frankie with a more supportive binder that both compresses enough for Frankie, and doesn’t cause any strain on his body.'

The doctor decided to get a young person who wasn't the patient to put one on? That's a bit odd. Over their clothes presumably but that's a shit demonstration. Patient needs to understand how to do it themselves. All very odd.

TorkTorkBam · 01/03/2020 12:26

Oh well, if a depressed anxious patient tells the doctor they need drink, drugs, sex, laxatives, no food, porn to feel better, well what choice has the doctor got but to give them what they want? FFS.

Haworthia · 01/03/2020 13:10

No other options
Breast binding is the only way
Wow

It is if you consult a doctor who used to bind and eventually had her breasts removed. The bias is astounding. Clear conflict of interest.

SisterWendyBuckett · 01/03/2020 14:14

Binding your breasts is painful, causes damage and makes it hard to breathe normally. Even if you wear the 'right' sized binder.

Young transmen often minimise not just their breasts but the thought process behind binding by using this argument.

Binding is a pain in every way, and does not help with 'chest' dysphoria. In fact, I know that it often makes things much worse.

For many it can only lead one way...and that is to the removal of healthy breasts via a double mastectomy.

FrogsFrogs · 01/03/2020 16:33

I've seen guidance for scouts I think it was around trans boys saying that if they bind it can impede their breathing and so understanding should be given if they can't or don't want to join in with more vigorous activities.

So progressive. Really Great.

JellySlice · 01/03/2020 17:15

“Dr Ronx’s proper role is therefore to respect that choice, while offering medical advice on how to do it in the right way.”'

To respect a child's choice to self-harm?!

What is the right way to self-harm?!

Beggars belief.

Why don't anorexic girls get treated this way?

hoodathunkit · 02/03/2020 08:58

Having watched the Unshockable Dr Ronx on the BBC I am left feeling extremely confused about a few things.

I am not a doctor but have worked in the NHS for some time and in my experience of working in sexual health I have never before encountered a doctor whose qualifications, experience and expertise were in emergency medicine offering testing and advice on sexual health issues.

Does the BBC consider that, byt identifying as "queer" Dr Ronx is some kind of "expert by experience" (a category I have significant concerns about).

Perhaps the most obvious indication that Dr Ronx was out of her depth and providing false information to patients was when she was advising a young woman about the risks of pregnancy associated with unprotected sex. Her assertion that one unprotected episode of sex would be all it took to get pregnant was correct.

Her comment that was (approximately so don't quote me) that "all it takes is for one sperm to get into your uterus to fertilise an egg" was incorrect. Fertilisation occurs not in the uterus but in the faliopian tubes and the fertilised egg then makes its way into the lining of the uterus for gestation.

I learned this not while wokring in sexual health but while studying biology at school.

Hope this helps

ChattyLion · 02/03/2020 09:14

Spot on Hooda

ChattyLion · 02/03/2020 09:15

You have to worry when a doctor doesn’t know the difference between fertilisation and implantation.

Helenjohanna · 15/05/2020 18:28

Hiya. Did anything come of this? Did you make the complaint?

Helenjohanna · 15/05/2020 18:29

I was responding to a specific reply, but it didn't quote. I seem to have forgotten how to quote a reply.

Antibles · 15/05/2020 19:21

Great post chattylion

This is awful and makes my blood boil. The damage this bullshit is doing. The BBC, apart from the honourable mentions, appears to be captured by this damaging juggernaut. I can well believe the number of trans people at the BBC is well above the national average. Again, this ideology aims at our children to get them indoctrinated young.

You know when you wonder what future generations will look back on and think wtf: the concept of trans will be one of them.

Cutting clitorises off: bad and backward.
Cutting breasts off: good and progressive. ??

Lordfrontpaw · 16/05/2020 15:08

BBC don’t reply to complaints - I made one before Christmas and another in Feb - nada.