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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Tony Blair warns Labour to avoid identity politics

88 replies

womaninblue · 20/02/2020 12:20

I canvassed for Labour during the run-up to the election and I lost count of the number of former Labour voters who told me they'd consider returning when someone like Tony Blair, someone they deemed 'sensible' and not dogmatically ideological, was running the party. Blair does seem to understand people in a way that Corbyn and Momentum don't.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/feb/20/tony-blair-only-a-complete-renewal-of-labour-will-do

OP posts:
VikVal81 · 21/02/2020 12:28

Labour lost the election because they have lost the British working class vote. They rubbished the concerns and experiences of many people at the lower end, I live on a large council estate, I work, many don't or have several part time jobs. There are many experiences and opinions based on as such that Labour never wanted to listen to over the last 20 years and now theyre paying the price. The real world is a different world to Labours ideology and I think perhaps the real world is a different world to many of the mum's on here, but the real world is the real world for a sizeable percentage of British families and until Labour admit and even completely re-evaluate what they actually stand for, they will never win again. A coalition with Liberal Dems would be even more disastrous! Blair was a good salesman and saw that the left is too toxic and destructive to be any base for a party to campaign off so he placed himself to the centre of the spectrum. Labour, at minimum, must return to the centre.

Goosefoot · 21/02/2020 13:53

I think Justhadathought has it right -Blair can see identity politics generally as a political dead end, and really an ideological dead end. Whatever else he is, I don't think he's stupid. I have little time for him politically, I think he espoused not really a centrist position but one which ultimately favoured global corporatism. But there is a sense in which the gender question is just the most urgent example of the results of this - the whole thing is a problem be it about race, religion, sex, whatever. And if it is allowed to stand and become endemic in politics the results are going to be bad for more than just one party, and I think Blair has enough of a mind to see that.

However, however - I think it's important to remember how it is that the party has become so out of touch with what it's members actually believe, with what people believe. I think the answer is that it stopped being a member driven organisation, with representatives chosen in local constituencies, and instead became an organisation where the people at the top imposed their vision on everyone below.

And Tony Blair has a lot to answer for there.

Cwenthryth · 22/02/2020 22:28

Found the speech online to watch here

institute.global/tony-blair/120-years-labour-party

Anonymouse99 · 22/02/2020 23:16

*I think it's important to remember how it is that the party has become so out of touch with what its members actually believe, with what people believe. I think the answer is that it stopped being a member driven organisation, with representatives chosen in local constituencies, and instead became an organisation where the people at the top imposed their vision on everyone below.

And Tony Blair has a lot to answer for there.*

Yes yes this. I agree with him on this but definitely believe that his policies were what started to move the Labour Party away from its core voters.

Voice0fReason · 22/02/2020 23:56

I wouldn't trust him but I do agree with what he said and the Labour party should listen to him because they are haemorrhaging votes and support with their current stance.

StrictlyAFemaleFemale · 23/02/2020 08:15

I miss him. I dont agree with war in iraq or huge amounts of tuition fees but he did a lot of good for a great many people, and yes got labour elected for 3 terms. He just seemed to get how things are played out in the media and how the electorate respond.

MsTSwift · 23/02/2020 08:32

Yes the war and the relationship with us was got wrong but I really like Blair. He did a lot of good that’s overlooked as fashionable to despise him.

Read an article saying it’s easier for the right to win because they support the status quo and basically support selfish behaviour lower taxes etc. In order for the left to overturn that and win the candidate needs to be really special and have strong appeal. Which Blair did and Obama.

Goosefoot · 23/02/2020 13:17

Hmm, I don't think I agree with that. For one thing many people who vote for right parties at the moment do so not because of lower taxes - there are those who do it for that reason, but by no means all - but others do for some reason around values.

that forgets though is that many left parties have done very well over the years because people did feel that the party was looking out for them. They may not have been promoting far left state marxism, but they were immersed in actual left wing interests - social infrastructure like housing and education, unions and workers rights.

These parties have begun to fail as they became, they said, more centrist, by which they meant, concerned with global corporatism, making sure capital and labour were easily movable across borders for the benefit of capitalists, making bankers happy, etc. Basically, everything Blair pushed. Initially it created a surge as it captured the bourgeoisie vote along with their traditional workers base, but now their credibility with the base has simply run out.

AsCoolAsLangCleg · 23/02/2020 13:54

Cherie Blair has tweeted Janice Turner's Times story about puberty blockers.

MarchDaffs · 23/02/2020 16:58

The Iraq war is so, so far from the average voters conscience that it’s not even funny. Your average voter does not give two shiny shits about the Iraq war.

I'd imagine the majority don't consciously care, but the impact of it is still very widely felt. The decision to go to war essentially on false pretences and bullshit the population into (somewhat) accepting it had a huge impact on the level of trust we're willing to place in politicians. That in turn was of course relevant to Brexit, given that the majority of the political class correctly identified it as a fucking terrible idea: their communal standing has been damaged and that's part of the reason how leading Brexiters who by any definition are the Establishment were able to present leaving the EU as some kind of challenge to the elite. There's also the knock on effect of destabilising Iraq on the rest of the Arab world and the creation of the refugee crisis because of this, which again lots of voters are concerned about.

So while most voters aren't directly giving many fucks about Iraq, I don't think the issue as a whole is as far removed as you're arguing here. It's just not being framed and identified it that way.

LadyMadderRose · 23/02/2020 20:31

Marchdaffs so true. I hadn’t put Iraq and brexit together like that before.

Bagofoldbones · 23/02/2020 22:10

I see you Cherie Blaire come and join us on MN Grin

lucasthecat · 23/02/2020 22:41

The Iraq war and the Response and opposition to it have changed the world and not for good,I think. It will be a long time before the USA, theUK or any of the west - get involved in dealing with despots dictators and psychopaths - Some will cheer - but every time I see the suffering in Syria - I imagine the people clinging on for life - pray for a Bush or Blair to launch an air and land offensive to support them - More people have died in Syria than died in Iraq and its aftermath - Sitting on your hands and doing fuck all - is now the Moral high ground

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