R4 Trans Hormone News Headline

[Mossyrock]

Did anyone else hear this? In the headlines at 6am news summary.

Report that some trans people are ordering hormones online because of need to wait for NHS treatment. Report about Victoria Derbyshire (I think?) investigation. NHS announcing initiative in spring to speed access to gender clinics, currently 1-3 years.

My immediate reactions:

This is 'balance' for increased GC reporting in recent days

What about women? Current HRT shortage for menopausal women, long waiting times for gynaecological treatment

Focus was specifically on access to hormones not general exploration and therapy for trans identifying people. Hormones should not be the presented as the logical first step.

Irresponsible politicisation of suicide. One person interviewed apparently said that they were forced to buy hormones online as an alternative to suicide

Similar experience here. Young family member was physically assaulted by a drugged up student whilst living in halls and needed orthopedic surgery to prevent life long disability. A three year wait, in severe pain and on heavy painkillers....by which time the damage would have been irreversible.

The London consultant we saw privately offered to try to put them on his NHS list but confessed the 10 month wait would also be too long. Instead a big bill, but surgery the following week.

(University, one of the woker ones, were useless btw, they really did not care. Perhaps had the student been in the 'wrong body', rather than simply wanting to repair the one they had, they would have been keener to help. )

Yes, but it is reasonable for us as a society to determine priorities. Alcoholics dont normally get liver transplants, say, even when the alternative is death.

The Mail at its finest: mol.im/a/8015559

They copy the BBC story then have a linked article about how ex-Tavi clinitions are concerned about over diagnosis and prescribing.

Of FFS just watching this in the BBC lunchtime news "she had two choices, suicide or buy hormones online"

How much more irresponsible can you get - whatever happened to the Samaritans reporting guidelines?

I'm GC, but I'm a bit uncomfortable with the attacking of the transwoman on the BBC report. That was a vulnerable young person relating their experience.

I agree trans-rights should not trump the rights of others, but I saw a person at the end of their rope.

I agree the reporting was irresponsible.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine

Infuriating and irresponsible. Since when did the BBC know more about suicide prevention than the Samaritans?

www.samaritans.org/about-samaritans/media-guidelines/best-practice-suicide-reporting-tips/

Give me what I want or I will kill myself. Sounds just like a teenager's tantrum, i.e emotional blackmail of the highest order.

Exactly, MingeofDeath.

I've spent decades being suicidal due to pain and hormonal problems. Every GP I've seen has told me my pain is due to my depression or my depression causes my pain. None have ever suggested anything other than anti-depressants or the Mirena coil (major push for years for me to have that).

It took 22 years and one private consult with a neuro to discover I have Transverse Myelitis and another with a gynae to find that I'm progesterone intolerant.

I was put on HRT to help with menopause symptoms that were disabling me and causing relapses with the TM. After battling 2 years to get the right HRT to suit me I now can't get it.

It's their choice to have treatment. It's not our choice to have to battle for our treatment and medications. Why is a minority being given priority over a majority?

Is it just that women are just being told to grin and bear it yet again?

"she had two choices, suicide or buy hormones online"

Say that to all the thyroid patients who cannot get adequate NHS treatment. Many of them have no choice but to buy their hormones clandestinely online either. Many feel so low they feel suicidal. Again predominantly women. Again mostly fed anti-depressents and told to go away.

Yet a couple of men shout for 2 mins and everyone bends over backwards to accommodate them.

There are very many people within the mental health system who threaten suicide on a regular basis in order to get attention. I’m not making any judgement of those people because the reasons why they do it are complex, and frequently the very nature of the way the MH system is set up fuels that cycle. There are also very many people in the mental health system who are treated like they are attention seeking when they most definitely are not. Anyone who has had even a small amount of experience of the MH system will be fully aware that there are certain labels that make it almost impossible to be taken seriously whether a person deserves that label or not. Yet here we are, where a person is very blatantly saying if they don’t get x then they will have to kill themselves and they are treated as if nothing else matters apart from giving them what they demand.

There are very many people within the mental health system who threaten suicide on a regular basis in order to get attention.

My son has been told sometimes quite openly by MH assessors that the only way to get to the top of the MH treatment list is to say you are suicidal.

If TWAW then why are they complaining about being treated like women.

You can’t have it both ways

I'm beginning to hate these people. If that makes me a transphobe I don't fucking care.

If TWAW then why are they complaining about being treated like women.

You can’t have it both ways

Well yes you can. You can be a nominal woman whilst retaining male privilege. Even better

I definitely saw this article as emotional backlash for all the labour stuff in the news the previous two days.

My take home message from this article was that if a person is willing to risk ordering drugs off the internet then they are mentally ill. The mental illness needs addressing not affirmation.

I agree FemaleAndLearning .

The NHS should meet the needs of all women whether trans or CIS. Not for us to decide on whether someones has mental health issues or dictate someone else's medical need.

First of all, please don't use offensive terms like "c*s".

Second, yeah sure the NHS should fund everything for everyone all of the time forever more, and we'd get a free unicorn with every appointment.

But even if they did, that would still bring gender extremist trans activists' demands into conflict with existing, legally-provided, sex based rights for women.

Anyone that says "do what I want or I'll kill myself" needs help with their mental health as a priority. That's not diagnosis over the internet.

*If TWAW then why are they complaining about being treated like women.

You can’t have it both ways

Well yes you can. You can be a nominal woman whilst retaining male privilege. Even better*

Then as you say they are “nominal” women not women.

If you are going to say TWAW then the male privilege has to go otherwise you are not a woman.

Is this reporting even good PR for the trans movement? With the NHS in the state it's in, most people are not going to be particularly sympathetic to complaints about delays in treatment that is often seen as dubiously evidenced/cosmetic/unnecessary. It just starts people thinking about whether these treatments ought to be publically funded.

If you are going to say TWAW then the male privilege has to go otherwise you are not a woman.

Point.

Well yes Kantastic. And would they be jumping ahead to get endocrine appointments for their hormone treatment?

Isn't 'off the internet' people like GenderGP/Helen Webberley who used to be signposted by Mermaids.

Surely no risk there then......

The BBC is just a trans propaganda machine now

That BBC News (Victoria Derbyshire programme) article "Transgender patients self-medicating over NHS waits" www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51530274 reminded me of part of the recent Twitter thread by Malcolm Clark @/twisterfilm

(My bolding)

"8./What drives a politician to risk their reputation on such nonsense. Here's RLong_Bailey on self -ID. She justifies it with references to difficult journeys, pain and suicide stats. The gender identity lobby seem so often to revel in this sadness and faux pity. "

video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1229542656386248704/pu/vid/720x1280/uoLUNoPpHNRism5Q.mp4

"9./ And why does that matter? Emotions affect the quality of our decision-making even when we don't realise we're experiencing them. Here's Jennifer Lerner on our PBS show reminding us of a truism: even unconscious emotions shape our decisions"

video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1229542966777307136/pu/pl/ivAkyEGQmANyl_iD.m3u8

"10./ She designs experiments to subtly induce emotions in people who aren't aware of it and explores how this impacts on seemingly unrelated decisions like a financial purchase. Astonishingly people who feel subconsciously sad will pay up to 5 times more for something."

video.twimg.com/ext_tw_video/1229545840609550339/pu/vid/360x640/m6bquh9I3b3hik-a.mp4

"11./ No one knows why. One theory is that unconscious low level sadness throws out of kilter how we value things. Perhaps the strangeness of the delusion we're witnessing is in part driven by the contagious Warren type weepiness that skews her judgement and that of supporters. "

Full thread:
threadreaderapp.com/thread/1229539824031485952.html

Archived: archive.ph/XjkMe

Mumsnet thread:
"Malcolm Clark on the madness of crowds"
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3826485-Malcolm-Clark-on-the-madness-of-crowds