Collapse of confidence in police

[BovaryX]

The Telegraph reports that public confidence in the police to investigate actual crimes is at an all time low. This is in the same issue which gives prominent coverage to Harry Miller's case.

As few as one in nine people believe police would solve their case if they were victims of crime, according to an exclusive YouGov poll that exposes a collapse in public confidence in the criminal justice system.

It depends on your definition of "very serious" I suppose.

My DS was robbed at knife point in broad daylight. The police wouldn't even take a statement.
A week later a young man was robbed and stabbed to death in the same area. I have no idea if the two crimes were related, but the point is that the people who do this have no fear of being caught.

Not surprising. Had an experience similar to many here. Man in recognisable company van deliberately knocked DH off his bike, kicked him and spat in his face leaving cuts bruising and head injury.

The police went round the company once but the company said he ‘wasn’t working’ that day, they told us they didn’t have the resources for further follow up. That was that

However as per theHarry Millar case if someone reads something on the internet that offends them they are all over it like a rash.

I do appreciate that the term “very serious” is hard to define. A jewellers 5 mins from my house was being robbed and the shop next door phoned the police only to be told “there was no one available”. Really, what’s the point in phoning? And it’s only a matter of time before vigilante gangs crop up.

Doesn’t surprise me. My local force actually released as statement saying that they won’t investigate burglaries any more . I have an ongoing issue with domestic violence between some neighbors. I had to call them yet again recently as he was attacking his girlfriend, the police took about 45 mins to turn up (bearing in mind this was an emergency call). By that time he’d beaten her up and run off. Their response was ‘it’s a shame he’s not here as we would have liked to talk to him, there’s not a great deal we can do right now’. They also left it to me to make sure the children were reported to SS as ‘we’re very busy and in theory info should be passed on but sometimes things get missed’.

The thing is doesn't everyone occasionally get a bit of random abuse. Sometimes people aren't very nice, but so what? I don't think they do OFTEN escalate into violence. I think it's actually quite rare? From time to time, people abuse my husband in the street. I'm sure, as we are all/mainly women, we've all had random sexist abuse in the street, too. I can't imagine bothering the police about it. Who thinks this is what the POLICE are for? The police isn't your mum, or the dinnerlady.

I mean...like, ok - once the butcher in the market called my DH a cripple and laughed at him. So... I told everyone I know and we all stopped shopping there. Isn't that a more reasonable response? Natural justice? Not really sure why you'd get the police involved in such petty bullshit. I think that butcher is a dickhead, but I don't think he should go prison or lose his business entirely. I very much doubt he's about to embark on a campaign of terror against the disabled. He's actually just a bit of a prat, as many have been and will be.

I just think it's all really silly. Can we get some adults in the room.

I really don't think it can be all just blamed on cuts. There is a lack of neighbourhood policing which helps to foster trust and because the police are less likely to bother with theft/burglary which will affect more people than a crazy axe murderer the trust is further eroded.

VashtaNerada and yet the police have the resources to pursue someone over a limerick, arrest a woman in front of her children over a Twitter spat. Attend any Pride event, wearing their rainbow lanyards, in great numbers. It’s amazing what they can find the resources for isn’t it?

I have had my opinion changed. I had mixed experiences:

About 12 years ago I had my car stolen, they did nothing. I went out in our other car to get fuel and they drove past me! I followed them back to a steer and they went in a house. I called the police telling them where they/the car was. I heard nothing for 2 days. I went back over there and it was still in there. I called them again and waited for them to come and retrieve it. We had to pay the cost of the retrieval. After they had forensically tested they car they said we could pick it up. Told me it was drivable , I got there and the driving column had been damaged as they had been driving with a screw driver. There were loads of cigarette butts. When I mentioned they weren't ours, they said "oh, we had better hang onto it and test them". They got DNA but couldn't charge him as couldn't prove he stole it, he wouldn't say who did and they couldn't prove her hadn't been in the car without my permission! He got a slapped wrist.

I do have a good experience though. I reported historic child sexual abuse in 2015. The police were amazing and sensitive. They located other victims and he is now serving a 16 year sentence as a category A prisoner. I will always be grateful to them.

I think most people think the police are for preventing and investigating violent crime (including sexual crime) and theft, particularly home burglaries and street robberies so people feel safe and don't take to vigilantism. I'd say the other big public duty is stopping public disorder from getting out of hand, eg carting off drunks on a Saturday night when they get too lairy for their own good, sorting out big crowds, etc, again, so people don't take these matters into their own hands.

Interpersonal stuff, debate, disagreement is our affair, as it's better for people to sort this stuff out themselves in a civil society.

But they don't seem to think this.

What do they think their job is?

However as per theHarry Millar case if someone reads something on the internet that offends them they are all over it like a rash

I think this collapse of public confidence in the police is justified. Reading some of the examples on this thread is an illustration of police failures. It is unacceptable that crimes are not being investigated. If criminals perceive there is zero consequences, recidivism and escalation are inevitable This should be a government priority.

why are so many crimes not even recorded?

Why won't they class hatred of women as a crime? Hating women actually does lead to violence, but because it's so rampant and the police are too busy on twitter, they won't change it.

Lojoh, that’s a disgrace, outstanding even amid all the other horror stories. I hope your husband has recovered from the hit-and-run injuries.
Twenty years ago, when i called police over harassment from a petty-criminal neighbour, I was surprised and impressed when the police came and warned them off. They were also helpful a couple of other times, which totally restored my faith in the police.

Sad to say, I can’t see that happening now. The decent ones might still care, but they now have to fill their quota of logging rude remarks on Twitter instead of protecting the public.

Catting exactly. Of all the hate crimes, hating and abusing women arguably leads to the most injuries and deaths.

I'm not sure that expanding the definition of hate crimes even further is a good solution to people being criminalised without due process. I mean where does it end. Once the woman in the pizza place was rude to me. Hatecrime her! My neighbour called me a bitch for telling him off about parking over our dropped kerb. Hatecrime him. Play the rough music!

I saw Goody Osbourne with the devil!

The whole system is under strain. Courts have been closed and the CPS has been cut resulting in fewer cases going to court. I have friends who work as criminal solicitors and their caseload has fallen dramatically, The Times within the last week or so reported that paedophile cases were taking 2 years to get to trial and the long delay was jeopardising the outcome. I think the Tory party will have to act as they are the party of law and order and it is ridiculous to be pursuing these types of incidents at the expense of actual crime. It will start to shine a light on the whole area. I think the Labour Party will find it was an unfortunate time to sign those pledges - people can see what they actually mean.

I do think hate incidents have their place though. I remember a case where a mother and her disabled daughter were abused and harassed by local ‘youths’. They reported the abuse many times but the police took no action as they were not crimes and a pattern wasn’t built up. In the end the mother took her own life and that of her daughter as she couldn’t cope. In this case they could be useful.

I'd like to think something will be done about this

The number of female homicide victims in England and Wales has risen to the highest level since 2006.
There were 241 female victims of murder, manslaughter and infanticide in the 12 months to the end of March 2019, up 10% on the previous year.

Almost half (48%) of female victims were killed in a domestic homicide, with the suspect a partner or ex-partner in 38% of cases.

Violent criminals are not going to be deterred by having a hate incident recorded against their name. Actual accusations we've committed a crimes we have an opportunity to prove innocence in court.
I honestly can't see the point of recording hate incidents especially when they don't cover al, protected characteristics in the equality act.

I'd only call the police if I needed a police report number for insurance

IDK if you're familiar with this "Something must be done" fallacy: "Something must be done. This is something. This must be done." ?

I completely accept that abuse and harrasssment happens. I completely accept that sometimes it can escalate into terrible crimes and have appalling consequences. I also agree that something must be done.

I don't accept that THIS is what must be done, as I haven't seen strong evidence presented that this is a good solution and that the problems this solution creates are less harmful. If there is evidence, I am open to it.

I don't see a causal line for example between recording 120,000 citizens as hate criminals without trial and preventing/reducing the domestic murder of women, or the tragic suicide of a powerless carer. That's where I'm coming from. I have looked for the arguments but found nothing. I'd like someone to at least make the case before throwing out the magna carta.

@Lojoh what is the motive for concentrating on hate crimes? I don't understand either or see the link. Politics? The fact it's less complex?

Generally I have confidence in The Police but a few years age a close friend and her boyfriend were threatened by a gang of youths late at night at a train station. They ran and she fell down some banking and broke her arm. The youths said she was running away from her boyfriend who was threatening her and they had tried to intervene to help her. The boyfriend was held in cells overnight and not given any information about her, despite her being taken away in an ambulance, he was also slightly hurt. CCTV backed up their story but the British Transport Police warned him (off the record) that if they didn’t drop it they would go after him for assault instead.They said that a stage couple had been drinking (his birthday, they had been out for a meal) they weren’t credible witnesses but it seemed a gang of youths already known to The Police were.
My friend was also visited in the hospital by a “domestic violence specialist” officer who harangued her to admit she was scared of her BF to the extent a nurse intervened and basically threw them out.
I know DV sadly happens and women are too scared to report but it seems that the Police had made their mind up that’s what this was, or perhaps it was easier to go after a nice young couple who could easily be intimidated by The Police rather than a bunch of scumbags had been in trouble many times before and knew what to say and not say

/me spreads hands

I can't speak to motives. I'm not remotely connected to criminal justice and couldn't claim to see into their hearts. All I can say is cui bono.

grandemac
There is an excellent Telegraph opinion piece which discusses those grim statistics. 17 per cent of murdered women are strangled and their killers are increasingly using a defence of 'consensual sex'
www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/can-no-longer-put-women-danger-homes/?WT.mc_id

I was brought up to respect the police. Back in the days when kids were told to go to a police officer if lost or in trouble. I was exactly the sort of person who would respect the police by default.

Gradually they tore that confidence away by refusing to follow up on crimes where the guy was seen and known. By refusing to respond to an ongoing problem of a gang of youths lighting fires on carpets inside the hallways of flats.

By a long series of mostly minor incidents down the years as witness, victim or friend/neighbour of victim.

Now they take on jobs for special interests groups there's nothing left to respect. Visiting people who have not committed a crime to threaten them makes the police just another gang to deal with and avoid.

Potentially more of a threat to me than the drug dealers in the town center who have never caused me any trouble.

@BovaryX have you seen the comments on that article, god it's so depressing.