Douglas Murray on denunciations and Lawrence Fox

[BovaryX]

Douglas Murray takes aim at the cancel culture and denunciation tactics at the heart of # no debate. Those who try to control and police what people think and say have dominated public discourse to its detriment. Many are aware of the existential threat to freedom of speech this faction represents.

Nothing that Fox said on Question Time was at all controversial. He suggested that the Labour party leader might be selected on merit and he suggested that Britain is not a racist country. Both these sentiments are held by the majority of the public. Yet so dominant have the minority-opinion pushers become that many people are persuaded that it would not just be career-damaging but socially fatal to say anything to the contrary. Even when that thing is the truth

@RoyalCorgi the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with. So I do believe his views should be nipped in the bud. He was wrong to say that Britain does not have an issue with racism and was called out for his lie. What’s wrong with that?

the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with. So I do believe his views should be nipped in the bud

Not only does this demonstrate breathtaking historical ignorance, it shows the totalitarian impulse which is so close to the surface for many modern zealots. Police Fox for what he didn't say. And chuck in a Third Reich reference for good measure. No wonder people are tired of this BS

@BovaryX I do think the police would behave in the same way. How many men are prosecuted for travelling to countries known for sexual abuse of young girls? Gary Glitter being the most high profile.

@BovaryX I was using the same analogy as the post I was responding to. Also no it doesn’t show ignorance of history, you however show your ignorance each time you post.

Er, hello? We're not talking about travelling to other countries. We're talking about organized abuse taking place in full view of the authorities, including girls being collected from children's homes

For the hard of thinking en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_they_came_...

@BovaryX it’s still illegal. So we only care about white girls because they look like us and could have been us? Sorry but I take issue with that. Vulnerable girls should be protected regardless of race.

because they look like us

Read the full thread

the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with. So I do believe his views should be nipped in the bud

Bollocks. This started with demonising groups of people and the shutting down of free speech. A position the so called left are very keen on taking.

the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with

And yet, a year ago progressives at Goldsmiths were suggesting sending people with wrong views to to concentration camps. These are people who would cheerfully send Fox to prison.

The problem isn't simply about people having wrong views. It's about those who believe they have right views feeling they should be entitled to punish those with wrong views.

the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with. So I do believe his views should be nipped in the bud

And how did the Nazi's find traction for their demonisation of the Jews and Roma? Amongst the easily-led or the free speakers?

To speak out in current times, where abuse is almost inevitable, seems to require someone to be opinionated, pig-headed and stubborn.

Jess Phillips, no way. Too many politicians and institutions are tiptoeing around the PC boundaries afraid to be seen to be out of line.

The ones speaking up. JKR because she can afford to, though is still brave, Ricky Gervais, Glinner, Fox, Piers Morgan, Posie Parker, Harry the Owl and, and and. Yes most are easy to criticise, but thank god they are there, and making it easier for us all to have a voice.

All I want is the freedom to say I am concerned about ASD girls thinking they are trans, white girls in Rotherham and elsewhere who appear to have no rights, Asian girls who are invisible but vulnerable. I don’t care if I have ‘white privilege’. We need to cut through this hokum. We need to be caring and compassionate and to protect those who need protection.

And yet, a year ago progressives at Goldsmiths were suggesting sending people with wrong views to to concentration camps. These are people who would cheerfully send Fox to prison

I think this tendency on the left to demonize anyone who disagrees with them, this conviction of their moral superiority? This Manichean certainty they are right and their desire to silence dissent and debate? It is totalitarian. Harry Miller said this

Totalitarian regimes don't come stomping in saying we're a totalitarian regime. They come in promising freedom and equality

most cringe thing i heard was
"free speech means no punish from gov, not free from consequence."

and woke hollywood, nba, blizzard happening showed what it means.

plus, i wasn't keen on meghan andthenfound out that she was mixed race;

Same here. Given her appearance her ancestors could simply be from Iberian, Latin or Hellenic families- all of whom are white European.

the issue is that the people who have views about sending people to concentration camps start out saying the same sort of things that Laurence Fox came out with. So I do believe his views should be nipped in the bud.

I think others have answered this more than adequately but this is a really dangerous position, in my view. He didn't say that people should be sent to concentration camps. He said that Britain isn't very racist. There's a pretty wide gap between those two opinions, and saying that view one should be "nipped in the bud" because it might lead to view two gets you pretty quickly down the road of suppressing freedom of speech. God knows we probably all have mildly disagreeable views that could hypothetically lead to something worse in the right (or wrong) circumstances.

I just think he was a knob for not realising he might not have any direct experience of racism, as a posh, white man. He lacks self awareness and needs to know when to stfu!

A man says he doesn't think Britain is a racist country automatically means he will at some point in the future endorse sending people to concentration camps because that's the inevitable conclusion?!
And those on the left are surprised when the average voter finds such sweeping statements and moral judgements on personal character offensive and alienating?

@nauticant

We know what it's about. It's an echo chamber for Bovary. The same people who complain about TRAs defining womanhood are busily defending the right of white people to tell people of colour what racism is. I'm out of here. It's like a BNP rally.

If the UK is such a racist place, then why do so many people from Asia and Africa try to come here illegally?
What does that say about the countries where they live?
The UK and Ireland have to be amongst the most tolerant and least racist countries in the World.

"I'm out of here. It's like a BNP rally."

Wow, just wow!

It's like a BNP rally
@justcly
What mendacious, offensive drivel.

@justcly sadly I’m minded to agree with you.

@andyoldlabour thank you for proving my point. Although to answer your question, they don’t know what they don’t know yet and some people are happy to escape life threatening environments for what another country may have to offer.

Bovary, interesting that we are accused of being an echo chamber for you.

I want parity. Equality in the receipt of offensive drivel.