Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Scottish GRA consultation

158 replies

SidJS · 06/01/2020 18:37

Ends 17th March

Does anyone have the link / email address to submit responses to? All can and need to respond - not just the Scots!

OP posts:
ReinstateLangCleg · 14/03/2020 09:45

Closes soon! Maybe something to consider doing over the weekend?

TheresMoreofUs · 14/03/2020 11:28

Definitely going to be citing some of the important findings in that report with regard to the decision-making capabilities of an adolescent. And the fact it is from the Scottish Sentencing Council means they cannot really ignore it!

scalliondays · 14/03/2020 11:49

This is a really important consultation regarding women's rights in Scotland. It also has implications for the rest of the UK as the other governments are watching.
You don't need to live in Scotland to complete it and if you go via www.forwomen.scot there's an easy guide to completing it under 'Ban the Bill'. There's no need to write lots and it doesn't need to take long to do.

NonnyMouse1337 · 14/03/2020 11:51

The Scottish Government say that because 16 year olds are able to vote, marry, sign contracts and consent to medical decisions like dental procedures etc therefore signing a statutory declaration to change legal sex is in the same category.

Except it's not about just changing your legal sex is it? The vast majority of older trans people, especially transwomen, keep their genitals and don't really undergo massive surgical and hormonal treatments.

Yet among young people, especially young girls, there's a massive surge in demanding access to hormones and mastectomies and hysterectomies. Being 'trans' in this demographic isn't about simply changing your hairstyle and clothing and a few pieces of documentation. It's extremely telling that the older, mature adults are happy to keep their sexual organs intact and functioning, while the younger the person, especially if they are female, the more likely they are to push ahead with extreme body modifications. And there's growing evidence that there are underlying factors for many of them - sexual abuse, bullying, eating disorders, depression and other mental health problems, autism, and don't forget peer pressure (especially via social media).
The report commissioned by the Scottish Sentencing Council says that while all young people are not really capable of making long-term rational decisions, the presence of these sort of issues and conditions further impacts on a young individual's ability to think beyond short-term gratification and detach from highly emotional situations.

Until the Scottish government can actually explain and justify what is going on for those under 25 who are jumping on the trans bandwagon, then it's clear that many of them are extremely vulnerable and are not fully sound of mind to be able to sign a statutory declaration saying that they intend to live in their acquired gender for the rest of their lives (what does that even mean?!).

ReinstateLangCleg · 14/03/2020 17:24

Agreed. Not only is this a very vulnerable group of youth but what actual evidence do we have that 'transitioning' tangibly helps these children and young people in the longer term?

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 15/03/2020 16:16

I have finally completed this - I spent some time but I can see it could have taken me only a few moments using the advice at forwomen.scot & wgscotland.org.uk Smile

So if you haven’t done it yet please please do so now - closes on Tuesday.

OldCrone · 15/03/2020 20:41

Under these changes to the GRA people would be making a legally binding declaration to 'live in their acquired gender', but there is no definition of what this actually means.

What does it mean to live in an 'acquired gender', and how can anyone check whether someone is actually 'living in their acquired gender' (which would be the basis of a prosecution for a false declaration)?

Without a definition of exactly how someone would live in their acquired gender and how anyone could check whether they were actually doing so, there is no possibility of anyone ever being prosecuted for making a false declaration.

This means that any man could declare himself a woman, become legally recognised as female, and he could not be prosecuted because the bill lacks any definition of what 'living in their acquired gender' actually entails.

littlbrowndog · 15/03/2020 22:58

Bump shout bump,shout. No,touching just bump,shout

morningtoncrescent62 · 16/03/2020 11:15

Another bump and shout from me. 36 hours left, everyone.

Here's the link to the guidance from ForWomen. There's guidance from other organisations mentioned and linked to in this thread, some of which will help you make a more detailed response, but this is probably the most straightforward and quickest if you've left it till the last minute and don't have much time.

forwomen.scot/

MrsSnippyPants · 16/03/2020 11:57

This is why it is crucial we complete it and have our say; we must not become like Canada:

threadreaderapp.com/thread/1238913102826987520.html

nicerainyweather · 16/03/2020 12:01

.

OldCrone · 16/03/2020 13:17

More easy to use guidance here:

lgballiance.org.uk/scotland-consultation/

This guidance gives a list of bulleted points as suggested responses to each question.

More guidance here:
www.transgendertrend.com/scottish-gender-recognition-act-bill-simple-guide/

It's better to rewrite what you feel most strongly about in your own words rather than just copy and paste if you have time to do this.

Consultation closes tomorrow. Does anyone know what time?

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 16/03/2020 16:48

Up again

Graffitiqueen · 16/03/2020 16:56

Done using forwomen.scot guidance

Floisme · 16/03/2020 17:47

Done. I can confirm that the forwomen.scot guidance linked just up the page is very straightforward.

QueenCartimandua · 16/03/2020 19:54

Done - using W&G Scotland guidance.

MurrayBlackburnMackenzie · 16/03/2020 20:25

We have submitted our response to the consultation.

Hope it might be helpful to anyone who has not yet submitted theirs although lots of great advice and guidance out there already from forwomen.scot, Women and Girls Scotland and WPUK.

murrayblackburnmackenzie.org/2020/03/16/our-response-to-the-scottish-gra-reform-consultation/

Thanks once again to everyone who has supported us to undertake this work.

Kath, Lucy and Lisa

terryleather · 16/03/2020 21:17

Done, with the help of WGScotland,
forwomen.scot, LGB Alliance, FPFW, Transgender Trend and MBM - thanks to all of them for their hard work and guidance.

Al1Langdownthecleghole · 16/03/2020 22:30

Quick bump - I've also used the forwomen.scot guidelines and got mine in.

there is still time folks.

Gibbonsgibbonsgibbons · 16/03/2020 23:22

Who’s left?
Calling my fellow procrastinators!

LizziesTwin · 16/03/2020 23:43

There's still time to complete this!

MoleSmokes · 17/03/2020 03:01

Response submitted - anyone know what time the deadline is today, 17 March? Noon? Midnight?

Anyone who has not already done it - see posts in this thread for links to advice from organisations concerned about the interests of women and girls.

Kicking myself that I somehow missed your very helpful, detailed post above about the Scottish Sentencing Council Nonnymouse1337!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3788251-Scottish-GRA-consultation?msgid=94336633

I did mention my concerns about the age of eligibility for a GRC and explained in a one-liner why it should be mid 20's but I would have added a link to the document you have linked if I had spotted your post sooner.

Given there is so little time left, if anyone has not completed a response yet I think the best way to do it would be via the suggestions on For Women Scotland and the link to the online response form on their home page: forwomen.scot

NonnyMouse1337 · 17/03/2020 07:04

That's ok, MoleSmokes. There's so much information to reference (which can be a good thing!) so it can be hard to capture all of it.
It will be good that all of our submissions will have a variety of angles and arguments highlighted.

I've been working on my submission for a couple of weeks, but ended up staying up until about 1:30am finishing it all off. I might fall asleep at my office desk later today!!

I used For Women Scotland, Women and Girls Scotland, the SNP women's pledge one. Didn't have time to incorporate LGB Alliance suggestions, but I noted that a number of points they made was similar to ones I already had, so it should be fine.

I think mine ended up being about 14 pages long!! I've tried to proof read it several times. I hope it's coherent enough. My brain was struggling to stay conscious towards the end. 😆

NonnyMouse1337 · 17/03/2020 07:08

Regarding deadlines - the consultation only says the deadline is today. No time has been specified. Technically you should be able to submit until 23:59 tonight, however, IMO it's better to send your submissions in before close of business hours i.e 17:00.

LizziesTwin · 17/03/2020 09:16

The site for the consultation on the GRA crashed - please submit as early as you can.