Why the Labour Party will not elect a woman

[PersonaNonGarter]

Just seen the Britain Elects poll of Labour members. Keir Starmer ahead on 31% with Rebecca Long Bailey on 20% and Jess Philips on 11%.

The Labour Party is too male. Even though women desperately need representation, Labour continue to romanticise heavy industry (manly) over the needs of eg retail workers (woman’s work). And even the recent Woke intake are steeped in this rose tinted Marxist Down Pit crap that lauds traditionally male roles.

So yeah the candidates might look like the women are putting on a good show. But a man will win.

Labour have a misogyny problem, but I am relieved that Starmer is in the lead as he is the only one with a remote chance of being elected both by the party membership now and the public in a GE. JP is hated by many in the party so doesn't stand a chance with them. Long-Bailey is just appalling and I would rather see a man in the role for the next 50 years than her at the helm because, if she wins, we will be stuck with the Tories forever.

I will never vote for some one based on their sex. I will vote for some one whose views are similar to my own, and someone I think can win an election.

At the moment, my preferred candidates are Kier for leader, Jess Phillips for deputy.

That view may change (especially if David Lammy decided to stand).

The sex is, to me, less important than their stated intentions. Which can/ will change

if David Lammy decided to stand

David Lammy pushed the GRA through parliament and told anyone who expressed concerns about its abuse that they were delusional. No way I will ever vote for him.

Seriously fuck Labour. Put the old dog out of its misery and let's try and build something else.

I actually agree here, despite Labour activism being in my family for at least the past 4 generations and still having many Old Labour people I know who are deeply principled and who I have a lot of respect for. These include very strong women who have their voices respected and listened to and are as far away from the London elite as it is possible to be.

At least in Scotland we have a left wing alternative to vote for in the SNP. I've actually felt embarrassed at a lot of the nonsense the Labour party have come out with.

I don't think any of the main political parties care about women very much.

Does Starmer know what a woman is? He’s most certainly been asked. As there has been no direct response one can only wonder. I’d prefer a leader to be less frightened and willing to shout from the rooftops.

But could he risk coming down on one side or the other though, would it lose him too many votes either way? Best to stay neutral at the moment I suspect.

Jess Philips is too outspoken to be a leader, she’s not got the diplomacy required

You are aware who the current President of the US and the current Prime Minister are?

@BlackForestCake very good point.... I take it back!

It's my understanding that the Labour membership has always voted for the furthest left male candidate for leader, does anyone know if that's correct?

Couldn't have been when Tony Blair got in though. Whatever those conditions were when he was chosen need to be recreated. Until then they're stuck in the wilderness.

I say "they" but I'm a party member, so I feel like "us". I'd be over the moon if there was finally a female leader, but I agree with others that Starmer is the only electable one (love Jess Phillips though).

Also I have a theory that Labour would have lost just as badly in 2017 as last month, except Theresa May was a woman, and I have a horrible feeling that lost the Tories some votes

It's my understanding that the Labour membership has always voted for the furthest left male candidate for leader, does anyone know if that's correct?

Hi there summerpavilion. It’s really complicated as although individual members have been able to vote since Neil Kinnock was leader, the rules have changed over time. Neil Kinnock beat Michael Meacher and subsequently Tony Benn - both more left wing than him. John Smith defeated Bryan Gould. Neither was particularly left wing but Bryan Gould was more anti European. Tony Blair defeated Margaret Beckett & John Prescott. Again, there was not much in it in terms of right wingness but Blair was seen as more popular with the electorate. Gordon Brown stood unopposed. Ed Milliband was probably more left wing than his brother or Ed Balls but not more left wing thanDiane Abbott who also stood. Jeremy Corbyn’s election is the odd one out. Before him, there was a real realisation that members had to elect a potential Prime Minister, not party Leader.

The introduction of the £3 supporter category was a disaster in terms of entryism. Hoping the Corbyn cult is finally going to be defeated. I actually think Jess Phillips is quite popular except with Momentum supporters. Not sure if she would stand as they would give her such grief.

It's only since 1983 that Labour members (other than MPs) have had any say in who the leader was. They voted for Kinnock in 1988 and Blair in 1992 and Miliband in 2010 in roughly the same proportions as MPs did.

Allowing for both Corbyn victories and counting Red Ed as the left candidate, you get:

1983 true
1988 false
1992 -
1994 false
2007 -
2010 true
2015 true
2016 true

Four times out of eight contests where party members have been polled, your thesis is true, twice it's false and twice I think it doesn't really apply.

The thing is there hasn’t often been a hard-left candidate in leadership elections. Ed Miliband wasn’t that left IMO, he just looked it compared to David (although I have counted him above). In 2010 the real hard left candidate was Diane Abbott. John McDonnell couldn't even get onto the ballot against Gordon Brown in 2007. Tony Blair beat John Prescott in 1994. In 1992 neither John Smith nor Bryan Gould were considered left wingers. Neil Kinnock absolutely thrashed Tony Benn in 1988. Kinnock himself had been called soft-left in 1983, but he wasn't the furthest left candidate, that was Eric Heffer. In 1980 Michael Foot beat Denis Healey, but it was very close. Callaghan beat Foot in 1976 (although Foot had been slightly ahead in the first round of voting). Harold Wilson beat Callaghan and Brown in 1963. Gaitskell soundly defeated left-wing challengers in 1955, 1960 and 1961. Going any further back takes us to before WW2 so I'll leave it there.

What is quite shocking is that not only has Labour never had a female leader, there have only ever been four women even stand for election as leader.

Meanwhile in the yellow corner...

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7846459/amp/Im-pansexual-says-Lib-Dem-leader-Layla-Moran.html?__twitter_impression=true
'I'm pansexual': Lib Dem would-be leader Layla Moran reveals she is in a lesbian relationship - five years after leaving boyfriend who she admitted slapping

In identity politics top trumps we now have Layla who isn't just a woman.

Nope she's a Palestinian woman.

And nope she's not just a Palestinian woman. She's an LGBT Palestinian woman.

Personally I'm not interested in her identity anymore than I'm interested in her cooking ability or her flaming shoes.

I'm interested in her critical thinking skills, demonstrating good judgement and leadership qualities...

Layla Moran's girlfriend Rosy Cobb was at the centre of a controversy during the general election campaign when the Liberal Democrats became embroiled in a row over a faked email and legal threats to journalists.

Miss Cobb, then the Lib Dems' head of media, was suspended after the party's press office was accused of altering emails.

The political website Open Democracy ran a story in mid-November claiming that the Lib Dems had sold supporters' data to the Remain campaign during the Brexit referendum.

The Lib Dems started a legal fight with the website, arguing that they had sent a statement which had not been used. Open Democracy maintained that it had not received one.

The party forwarded an email they claimed had been sent – but the date it carried was the day before the request for comment had been made.

Miss Cobb was suspended pending a full investigation. She has now left the party.

bangs head on wall repeatedly

RTB...they don't mention her ability to see into people's souls.

(Is that a function of pan-sexuality I wonder?)

And in the blue corner

mol.im/a/7846317

Dominic Cummings seeking super-talented weirdos to work at No 10.

What did we do to deserve all this.

Layla Moran. I mean. But frankly who leads the Lib Dem’s is less important than who fronts Newnight or covers for Andrew Marr.

Also I have a theory that Labour would have lost just as badly in 2017 as last month, except Theresa May was a woman, and I have a horrible feeling that lost the Tories some votes

I don't think so given the success of Margaret Thatcher. Theresa May just ran a very poor campaign. Also there were voters prepared to at least give Corbyn a chance as the horror of Corbynism hadn't been fully unleashed in 2017.

I cringed at Layla Morans video about her pansexuality. I understand she wanted to be open about her personal life but explaining she got together with her gf after a few drinks was just TMI, can you imagine a male politician saying that?

The majority of the population won't know what pansexual is and will just see it as weird.

Kezia Dugdale and Ruth Davidson were both accepted as being lesbians during their leadership.

Out of interest I googled the leaders of Scottish Labour and three of the past eight have been women which is a huge improvement in the UK party as a whole.

As for Dominic Cumming, I think deliberately trying to attract the people who are not 'public school bluffers' goes in his favour.

The TMI on your personal life might be a LibDem thing following on from Nick (no more than 30 lovers) Clegg, rather than a female thing.

Needmoresleep, I can't read the article linked to as I cant access the DM on my computer (I refuse to bypass my adblocker to allow access), bu I don't think the the idea to recruit a "quirkier", non-traditional type of person to the civil service is a bad thing. From what I know of what he wishes to do, he is seeking to attract people with strong science and math backgrounds instead of the more usual PPE sorts - not a bad thing. Also, having more people who are non-traditional will allow for a more flexible civil service and one better prepared for a a tech-driven future.

Of all Dominic Cummings faults, coming up with this goal is not one of the worst ones.

Getting back to the actual politics of choosing Labour's new leader.

I'd rather a new leader was good for women (actual women) than a woman themself.

The Labour membership will elect this leader. The membership/activist base that the electorate has just rejected in er... wholesale fashion. I don't dislike Kier Starmer at all, in fact I quite like him, but he's a technocratic Remainer. All very nice for the people who did vote Labour at the election but hopeless for those who didn't. Both aloof techocracy and ultra remain have been rejected by the very voters Labour must win back.

The sad truth is that I don't think there is a single person in the PLP - possibly Lisa Nandy, but she's not exactly dynamic - who could build bridges between the metropolitan liberals and the non-metropolitan post-liberals.

Probably what Labour members need to realise is that they've been working on the assumption that the non-metropolitan post-liberals had nowhere else to go. But the truth is that it's the metropolitan liberals who actually have nowhere else to go. Had they realised that sooner, we'd have a Labour government now.

I saw on twitter someone say that there’s one person who would definitely win this leadership election hands down and that’s ... Jeremy Corbyn.

A depressing thought, but I wouldn’t be surprised. I saw some CLP motion proposed to congratulate JC on two great election results (in terms of percentage of votes) and for increasing the membership.

"The operation was a success, but..."

Have to say how impressed I was with Lisa Nandy during her interview with Andrew Neil on BBC2 last night. She actually had him on the back-foot. Calm, considered, confident, knowledgeable, articulate......I'd not seen her speak to this extent before. Real leadership material.

Even if Kier Starmer takes it this time, I sincerely hope she gets a senior shadow cabinet role - more experience and a further bid in the future? Kier Starmer is a bit boring and I'm not sure what he stands for - although he may well be a mediating and steadying influence on the party in the short term.

Just hope Dawn Butler fades away onto the back benches.

Women's work has always been seen as inferior to men's. The minute a profession is female dominated, it loses its status. Look at secretaries, for instance.