What is it like in India for women?

[MIdgebabe]

So we have a defendant woman burned to death on the way to a trial

Shooing of defendants by police celebrated

Accusations of false rape apparently being very widespread ( this may relate to sex being classed as rape if marriage was promised and not delivered.)

It feels like a disgust of sex , policing of them peoples lives, with blame often put at the woman's feet but wondered if anyone had insights

Thanks for starting this thread. On top of the horrific violence, it was the tweets from the Indian film director that really shocked, apauled, and tbh baffled me:

Such views were on full display in a series of social media posts by the Indian film director Daniel Shravan, who, in response to the Hyderabad rape case, suggested that “rape is not a serious thing, but murder is inexcusable” adding that “the government should legalise rape without violence for the safety of women”. The posts, now deleted, addressed women, telling them: “If you are about to get raped, hand over a condom to the rapist and cooperate with him while he fulfils his sexual desire. That way he will not try to harm you.”

What the actual fuck? I presume this is an educated man? I just cannot fathom this attitude.

This is the article btw: www.theguardian.com/world/2019/dec/05/india-woman-set-on-fire-on-way-to-testify-against-alleged-rapists

(appalled - I can't spell)

My Dad is indian and I when I visited India alone when I was 17, to visit family around the country for 6 weeks, I was assaulted more times than I have been rest (40 years) of my life. On the other hand, within the family, the woman were always in charge and it was a matriarchial set up. It is a hugely complex country which I don’t understand, and although lovely relatives always ask when I will bring my kids, I really don’t think I want to.

Lamahaha I'm fascinated by your account and wouldn't dispute it. I've heard of other women travelling alone there and having similar experiences.
I'm very well travelled and have had amazing experiences in countries that many would consider dangerous. I was hoping for that in India but on the whole disappointed.
It's good to hear it's not all negative.

I have been to India four times, two of them on my own, and never had any issues with harassment. But I agree with whoever said that it's a country where, whatever you say about it, you could also say the precise opposite. There are undoubtedly some utterly depraved individuals there, as we see from the cases which make the news, but I found the Indian people I encountered (and I often stayed in homestays rather than hotels) to be unfailingly hospitable, generous and charming. We got stuck there for an extra week once during the ash cloud incident in 2010 and the couple whose guest house we were staying in treated us like family, tried to refuse payment for the extra week, took us around town to meet all their friends, out to dinner, etc. They were the kindest people I've ever met.

So, no, it's not all negative. Though the bad bits are really, really bad.

Thank you for that lovely post Lamahaha.

There's a real challenge in discussing issues from other countries. As Fraggling points out, the situation for women isn't great anywhere - especially in the UK at the moment. It feels as if there's an unexpected global roll back of the rights and safety of women and children.

I often slept outside the front door, on a man,

OMG, what a typo! Laughing my head off. A freudian slip??? Of course, it's a MAT, not a MAN I slept on!

Another one! I really need to use the preview function more/

did a whole = dig a hole (for poo)

did a whole I thought it was just some strange euphemism

I guess rapid society change might be part of this ?

Forgive my lack of knowledge,but how much can I consider India has having a single culture ? Are there strong regional variations? I haven't had a chance to travel much unfortunately

Yes, there are very strong regional variations - for example each state has a different language. Geography and climate is very diverse.

Hinduism is the main religion but is practised differently in different areas, and of course a number of other religions - Muslims, Christians, Sikh, Jain's, Buddhist.... Caste, money, education, rural/urban all make a huge difference on day to day life.

For all the differences, there's loads in common too. A strong culture of respecting women lives side by side with the utter disrespect too.

It is most definitely not a single culture. There is not even a unifying language. Each state has its own language, with only a few of them being Hindi-speaking. The south is completely different -both in terms of the ethnic origin of the peoples and in the linguistic roots of the spoken languages - from the north.

It's massive
Billion people
My colleagues in bangalore told me, 5 different languages it was maybe
As an English person it's hard to conprehend

I've never been and only have colleagues words to go on so someone else who knows can say more.

The blokes I worked with from bangalore were all lovely.

Oh oops massive xposts sorry!

It's a lot more than 5 different languages, there over 20 official languages, and multiple other more localised / tribal ones as well.

Maybe she said main languages!

Thank you for info, really interesting.

25 or so years ago one of my best friends went to India with her idiot boyfriend for six months. We seriously feared that she wouldn't return. That he would dump her somewhere or they would get into a situation they couldn't handle, for they were both so naive. We all said "funny stuff". Haha! In six months we'll be like: "Hey Dick, where is Tracy?" And he'd be like: "Who?"(Not their real names)

When they came back A) she was very, very skinny. Like: the inmates from the concentration camps skinny. She hadn't realized herself until she saw how shocked we all were.
B) She was skinny because she had gotten ill and he had actually tried to dump her in the flea pit hotel they were in, in the middle of no-where and go on alone, as it was boring there and boring that she was ill.

I come from a very safe country and it is very typical for people from my country that they go abroad and do stupid things under the assumption that all countries are as safe as my home country. I have never quite understood how you can be that stupid.

I saw that tweet from the Indian film director. Not much comfort but when it was featured on the Daily Mail website I was heartened by the comments below the article. Lots of men condemning him, albeit they were not Indian, but just a general disgust.

We have had problems here with asian child abuse gangs and a lot of hidden abuse of females that goes on in asian households. There seems to be a general contempt for women in parts of asia that travels with them where they settle elsewhere. That is not to say that we do not have our own problems but in the main we have a voice and can shout out.

I am fascinated by India and have always wanted to visit but I wouldn't now. I would be a bit scared but mainly I don't want to go anywhere where there is such a fundamental abuse and degradation of females.

Is there any activism or charities dealing with this?

Is there any activism or charities dealing with this?

Yes, many, though mostly they are unknown outside of India or the region where they operate. I used to be involved with a charity that worked on several levels, including training women in various crafts such as tailoring and leaf painting and toy making, so that they could be independent it's still going strong, though I am no longer involved. I'm a supporter of another charity that helps kids, boys and girls, who have lost a parent and I sponsored one girl's education for many years she's now adult and has moved to Chennai. I met her a couple of times. It's a small private charity founded by a friend or mine, a German doctor.
India is actually teeming with NGO's, some of them quite scammy. The one I was with was founded by a group of Germans, who also canvassed for money in Germany, sold the products at Christmas markets etc, and did fantastic work -- literally raised up the area, building hospitals and a big school giving free English medium education to kids from nursery up to uni.
India can really get under your skin. I know hundreds of people who return year after year -- in spite of its bad reputation. If you know where you are going it is mostly safe.

I have a video I took when I was there last -- I was filming the area as I walked home, and the last part of my walk was through a quite deserted area, with nobody around. An Indian man on a bicycle rode past me. He then circled and rode past me again, looking back. And then he stopped, and addressed me. I was still filming, and only afterwards I realised that as I was alone, it could be regarded as an extremely risky situation.

Hmmm. I'm thinking I might try and post the video here. The only quibble is keeping it anonymous -- it's on my Youtube channel. I'll see what I can do.

I come from a very safe country and it is very typical for people from my country that they go abroad and do stupid things under the assumption that all countries are as safe as my home country. I have never quite understood how you can be that stupid.

I first left home to go backpacking through some extremely unsafe countries on a faraway continent when I was 19. I was gone for over a year and did some extremely stupid and reckless things. My parents had no idea where I was most of the time. Then, when I was 23, I did the hippie trail to India and stayed there 18 months, living rough.

Yes, it was very reckless but both those trips are experiences I treasure to this day -- perhaps the most important episodes of my life. Maybe stupid, but I learned so much and matured so much as well. I'd say my "stupidity" might have been a dimension of a quest for understanding; I just wasn't after safety in those days.

I have to say, if my daughter had done what I did I'd have been out of my mind with worry!
But times have really changed. The world is a much more dangerous place.
In spite of the fact that we now have safety nets and communication tools such as internet, email, cameras, tracking, visa cards etc -- all of which were far in the future back then.

@Lamahaha Why are a lot of your posts crossed out? Interesting content but hard to read.

I travelled in northern India in the early 90s with DH & a few friends, we were in our mid-20s. I have never been hassled so much in my life. Groups of young men would surround us & dare each other to approach & touch the women. It was horrible. It's a fascinating country & I'd love to see more of it, but I don't think I could bear to go back.

@Sarcelle, I don't see my posts as crossed out at all -- they appear as normal. Do you see only mine crossed out? Does anyone else see them crossed out? Strange!

Not crossed out for me.

Here is what they look like for me. Weird.

That's very weird! I've never seen that before on MN. Maybe ask HQ?