Ask Angela posters

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Seen in the female toilets at a beautiful pub in Wales on Tuesday. I think this campaign is fantastic. Hats off to National Pubwatch.

www.nationalpubwatch.org.uk/news/national-pubwatch-supports-ask-angela-campaign/

It would be better to have a pub scheme like the one mentioned upthread in sexual health clinics - because, even if word got out about the stickers, the sticker could be covered by hand when the pot was passed to the nurse. Pubs could have some kind of ticket (available in the loos) that could be covertly passed to bar staff when paying for a drink or returning a glass.

But if everyone knows what 'ask for Angela' means, wouldn't "could I have a word with you in private, please?" have the same effect?

No because staff are busy. They may have seen the woman have a few drinks and not want to get into a chat with her. They may think she wants to complain about something. Asking for Angela makes it clear straight away that she needs immediate help.

This has been around for a few years. And yes it's great that women have this resource.

Asking for Angela makes it clear straight away that she needs immediate help.

I take that point, but it does rely on the bar staff understanding the code - and bars rely heavily on temporary and short-term staff - so there's a risk it won't be immediately clear.

But if everyone knows what 'ask for Angela' means, wouldn't "could I have a word with you in private, please?" have the same effect?

Staff are busy. They don’t know whether the person in front of them needs help, or wants to rope them into some stupid request, or wants to complain about another employee, or maybe even wants to do a bit of their own sexual harassment. I don’t really know why this is difficult to understand.

They don’t know whether the person in front of them needs help, or wants to rope them into some stupid request, or wants to complain about another employee, or maybe even wants to do a bit of their own sexual harassment.

If someone wants to make a nuisance of themselves, it's just as easy to 'ask for Angela' with this intent, as it is to ask for a private word.

Pubs that have Ask Angela posters are part of the scheme - they train their staff to know what action to take (I hope).

Great idea

Pubs could have some kind of ticket (available in the loos) that could be covertly passed to bar staff when paying for a drink or returning a glass.

But those schemes really do depend on single sex loos which, like it or not, we do seem to be moving away from.

I think the sticker one could be utilised in pubs and clubs. The woman could put one on her glass, facing away from herself or the man, and hand it back to the staff asking them for ice, put in in a different glass, to top it up or it’s the wrong drink. Staff would spot it and could step in, in some way.

Sorry, ScreamingValenta, I got distracted and see you’ve already made that point.

I think it's so well known in the pub and club trade. Ask for Angela has been around for years.

As long as the cards were in the cubicle, they could still be picked up discreetly even in a unisex loo, and the idea would be that they could be passed to a staff member unseen.

Much easier to work "Angela" into a conversation though than asking for a private word. "Does Angela still work here?" or "my mum's friend Angela said your house white was really nice" is much less likely to trigger suspicion in a dodgy date.

Is this scheme designed for women on first/dates, or for women in abusive long term relationships too? I can understand it if the latter, but if you're on your first or second date with someone, in a public place, and he acted dodgy, why wouldn't you just order yourself a taxi?

It's for any woman that feels at risk Box

Does Angela still work here?" or "my mum's friend Angela said your house white was really nice" is much less likely to trigger suspicion in a dodgy date.

But why would you care if he was suspicious? Surely women would just say 'okay, my taxi is outside', and leave? He's very unlikely to attack her in a public place, and doesn't know her address to follow her.

MrsCollinssettled But if it's expanded to mean any reference to 'Angela' you then run the risk of false alarms. Angela is quite a common name.

It's for any woman that feels at risk Box

Ah fair enough. I can understand a woman in abusive marriage who has no where else to go but home using this.

It's worth knowing that you can tell the DJ too and they will put your behind their decks and alert security.

I'm still inclined to think that 'could you call security please?' would be a more effective way of summoning help than making cryptic references to 'Angela'.

Well obviously you are welcome to use 'call security' if you ever need help. Ask Angela is just another, more discreet way to ask for help without alerting your 'companion'.

Ask Angela is just another, more discreet way to ask for help without alerting your 'companion'.

I do understand that, but the point I'm making is that there's an inherent flaw in the idea.

For it not to be likely to alert your companion, it needs to be a secret known only to a limited number of people.

But if it's known only to a limited number of people, then the number of people it helps will also be small.

I agree, helping a few people is better than helping no one.

But a previous poster made another valid point - if you are in a public bar, does it matter if your companion knows you are seeking assistance? He is unlikely to be able to attack you in a public place, and he will soon know you have 'asked for Angela' when security turns up.

If you're in a long-term abusive relationship, even if your partner hasn't come across the scheme, the reaction is likely to be 'who the fuck is Angela?' 'you don't know any Angelas' 'what are you on about, Angela has never worked here,' etc.

Actually Screaming you are right. There's no point in having this campaign to help women.

There's no point in having this campaign to help women.

We need a different campaign that might actually be effective, like the sticker idea upthread.

This is far too much of a thing to make people think they are 'doing something' by spreading the word on social media, when actually when you look into it, it's not a very effective system and could even do more harm than good, if people start talking about 'Angela' to someone who has missed the memo, losing time when they could instead be asking for help in a non-cryptic way.

" I'm still inclined to think that 'could you call security please?"

how many pubs have security, most just have a few bar staff, its more about offering a quick exit.

So, if there are obviously no security guards, you could say: 'Can you help me get out of here quickly, please?' Or 'I urgently need help''. Or 'I'm being threatened'. Anything that's clear and unambiguous.

If people prefer to think that 'asking for Angela' is a good solution to the threats women can face, then fine, but I don't think it is. It's as if they are saying 'here's a magic word that will solve everything' and it really isn't that simple.

If it were as easy as asking for help (whatever wording is used), women would be doing this anyway - we don't need to be fed cryptic phrases by people on social media in order to know that, in most cases, if someone in a customer-facing role is asked to help someone in danger, they will.