New NHS guidance on same sex accommodation

[LukewarmCustard]

The guidance starts out well. '1.2 Guidance statement: Providers of NHS-funded care are expected to have a zero-tolerance approach to mixed-sex accommodation, except where it is in the overall best interest of all patients affected.'

But then there is Annex B, which says 'Trans people should be accommodated according to their presentation: the way they dress, and the name and pronouns they currently use. This may not always accord with the physical sex appearance of the chest or genitalia. It does not depend on their having a gender recognition certificate (GRC) or legal name change. It applies to toilet and bathing facilities (except, for instance, that preoperative trans people should not share open shower facilities).' Annex B was apparently written with input from the Government Equalities Office.

NHS accommodation is now mixed sex accommodation with allocations based on pronouns.

Sorry but ‘she - her - lady - penis’ reminds me of a kids tv song I half remember -‘3 of these words all go together, 3 of these words mean kind of the same, One of these words...’

New guidance. Even worse than the old guidance. Even though it was produced in response to objections.

This is fucking outrageous. Just thinking of how vulnerable I've felt whenever I've had to stay in hospital. How can we complain? Did NHS consult on this?

MIL recently spent a week in a ward with a 'lady' who had a penis, stubble and chest hair. This lady loudly farted at will and scratched her scrotum whilst she wore pink floral pyjama bottoms, no top but open pink gown make up

Think if this ever happens to a relative of mine, I will complain loud and long to whoever is in charge. The only way we’re going to stop this is by being more fucking awkward and louder than the narc men who are driving it.

The NHS knows perfectly well the difference between male and female - but it clearly only matters in a clinical sense, not in any sense relating to safety, dignity or emotional well-being of patients or staff.

So the NHS treats not bodies but airy fairy feels?

Thank god that wasn’t my mum on that ward - she would have thrown the mother and father of all fits. It would make the papers. My grandmother would have been worse...

Is it just the usual creeps having regulatory captured the NHS

Pretty sure you don't have to look any further.

They've got the front to talk about "zero tolerance for mixed-sex" and then talk about "well if any bloke wants to be in with the women, then we'll facilitate that".

Load of bollocks.

They won't have done an impact assessment on women. Nor will they have considered how religious women who cannot undress in front of men will be affected.

Women will be refusing to to go hospital. And will be discharging themselves rather than risk having to share with men.

Expect private health insurance to cash in with their guarantees of a private room. For those who can afford it only.

The only way we’re going to stop this is by being more fucking awkward and louder than the narc men who are driving it.

Damn straight, AnyOldPrion. At the same time, aggressive gender activists and those abusive people for whom they open these doors RELY on the fact that women are socialized to be kind, not to make a fuss, and also for very good reason to be frightened of male people --- particularly male people who act aggressively and unreasonably right off the bat.

The only way we’re going to stop this is by being more fucking awkward and louder than the narc men who are driving it.

This this this.

How many people usually share a ward in UK hospitals?

disinhibited sexuality in elderly people with dementia is far from uncommon and a sensible and experience management will build protection into their active safeguarding provisions.

But no, the woke bros with their friends in PN know better. In reality they don't know anything.

My dad is in a mixed sex dementia ward at the moment, the women are at one end of the ward and the men at the other but there is nothing to stop them wandering into each other’s rooms

Yes needmoresleep I had exactly the same thought about dementia having seen this for myself in care homes. Terrifying. I actually believe there would be a market for single sex care homes.

My Dad is currently on a Male hospital ward, along with another chap who adamantly refuses to wear hospital trousers or get under the covers. Today on visit I was greeted with his testicle coming out the edge of his incontinence pad/not pants.

I had dignity issues about this anyway but would be starting WW3 if that view was opposite my Mum's hospital bed instead

My elderly mum woke up to find another elderly lady in her hospital bed with her. They were both very frightened.

Mum is incredibly anxious and correct. She’d have been traumatized if that woman had been a confused male.

'1.2 Guidance statement: Providers of NHS-funded care are expected to have a zero-tolerance approach to mixed-sex accommodation, except where it is in the overall best interest of all patients affected.'

I can't see how it could be in the "best interest of ALL parients affected"
to share a room with someone of a sifferent sex unless there'a an emergency, complete lack of beds or staff etc. So it shouldn't happen on normal wards.

What about religious women? I’d have a hard enough time in my PJs in front of strangers let alone men in nighties - especially the types who really really want to be ‘in with the girls’. I wouldn’t sleep.

Since this is new guidance, will they have been required to do an equality impact assessment?

So where do we write to object?

I'd really like them to explain why zero tolerance to mixed sex wards. Spell it out. Why is this so important? (And why is it such a massive vote winner/vote loser for political parties?)

Now what exactly changes about any of that when a male person chooses a different identity?

By all means provide a private room, that person shouldn't be expected to be uncomfortable or distressed on the male wards because of their privacy, dignity, respecting their identity. By all means create additional single spaces for this, likewise female people who prefer not to identify as or with women.

But explain to me why the women whose needs are being met with the whole zero tolerance reasoning lose all that so important privacy and dignity and single sex provision if a male says so? They're two wholly incompatible, incoherent, ridiculous positions to try and hold concurrently. This will cost women access to health care, eventually it will cost lives of women.

Also thinking actually, of my brothers and male cousins who are largely too busy to be woke, and what they'll do and say if any of our mums/daughters end up on a ward, vulnerable in a bed near a male. Particularly if they see that male taking advantage of their position in any way. They won't stand around politely arguing with staff about policy capture or write to their MPs, trust me on this, and they really won't care what Pink News or Stonewall say. This needs to be in the papers, spread as widely as possible; this is a massive vote loser.

So, mixed sex then?

Does anyone know the procedure here for asking for equality impact assessments? I’m assuming we need to do a FOI request, would it be by individual trust do you think or is it at central government level?
I’m so fucked off with all of this. I’ve a chronic illness, a small child and I’m fucking knackered. It makes me feel so weary to contemplate how quickly our organisations can be talked into shitting all over women and girls, or teaching our children about extreme “empowering” sexual acts. Just arrrrrrrrrghhhhh sometimes

Angryresister asked where to write to object. I think this is one where a letter to your MP would be ideal. Provide the sort of real life examples which have come up on this thread. Ask them if they think this is fair to women. Make sure you mention the name and date of this document, as there are a few documents on same sex accommodation floating around. This document is 'Delivering same sex accommodation' from NHS England and NHS Improvement, September 2019.

I’ve just sent an email to my MP.

I’m livid