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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

"Cast Off - Diversity wars are raging in the knitting world'

447 replies

AncientLights · 28/09/2019 13:49

I've kept the title from the article in the print version of The Spectator 28 Sept, as I can't improve on it.

It's the most astonishing piece - well, astonishing and yet horribly familiar to us here. I'll summarise as it's not the done thing to do a big c&p job and would also be a kick in the financial teeth of the Speccy, who have done so much, via James Kirkup, to publicise the illogicality of the trans movement.

There is a knitter called Nathan Taylor whose online name is 'Sockmatician' - he sounds an interesting character, shall I say. Sockmatician seems to have cause huge offence (and here I will quote as it's so bonkers) by posting 'a poem on Instagram about 'diversknitty' in which he boasted it was a year since he had founded this hashtag, and asked that people use it kindly, rather than attacking one another'. Seems Taylor was committing violence against Bipoc (black & indigenous people of colour, it says here) by telling them how to make their arguments about inclusion, tone policing from a white man - utterly unacceptable.

The war started & raged on. Sockmatation has MH problems, was hospitalised, messages from his husband held no sway. Things got really bad with the yarn festival: yarn producers & other knitting personalities (who knew?) couldn't believe Sockmatition hadn't been uninvited, someone was glad she hadn't been able to attend after all as she'd have been unable to teach her session knowing he was down the hall. Unsupported allegations online about an assault. His patterns have been dropped from two books, one of which was the first official Harry Potter knitting book - the cover was reshot to remove Sockmatition's work. His business has suffered a 75% drop in sales.

There's a similar story about a Kate Davies who is based in the Scottish Highlands. She wouldn't join in denouncing people for their 'transgressions', so she's been attacked, too.

I read it thinking it must be an allegory but have come to the conclusion it's genuine. It is total, stark-staring madness and I can only keep saying to myself and to anyone else who will listen 'How on earth have we come to this?'

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Saucery · 02/10/2019 17:18

Mumsnet can set whatever rules they like. Like the one I fell foul of way upthread Grin
It’s always going to be a trade off between what you get from a site v your personal beliefs. When that balance tips too far for you, you leave those particular views off the site or you leave.

FlaviaAlbia · 02/10/2019 17:39

I meant legally. Yes those sites can legally do what they wish. I disagreed with the decisions they made and closed my twitter account and I've a spinster one now.

I'm in NI so I doubt you want to hear my opinion on those who voted for Brexit and those who didn't vote at all. I'm happy to discuss the consequences of the vote instead of discussing Brexiteers though.

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 02/10/2019 18:09

Kate Davies and the Sockmatician both only sell their patterns on Ravelry as far as I can see, which is a pity as I would like to support them both but not keen to use Ravelry again.

Saucery · 02/10/2019 18:35

Kate Davies has her own shop you can get the physical books (and individual patterns I think too) from, or places like Tangled Yarn do online sales of them too.

Saucery · 02/10/2019 18:38

www.shopkdd.com/books?sort=title_asc&page=1
I don’t know if you have any independent yarn shops near you but she sells through selected ones too.

No idea about Sockmatician. The frenzy about him is increasing now and there aren’t many shops brave enough to stock his stuff due to that.

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 02/10/2019 18:54

God, this is depressing. Crochet has been a great bolt hole when politics etc have got too exasperating and depressing. But not now.

My other bolt hole is anything to do with working dogs. And the other day I spotted a rare new post on a blog I loved when she posted regularly, but the new post was all about how having 101 new pronouns was great and did no harm to anyone (she didn't bother discussing women's sports...) and look, here is my new litter with no pronouns and gender neutral names! FFS. Dogs don't give a shit about pronouns, and many people buying a working dog want to know the sex for entirely sane reasons (bitches in season, cost of neutering, their own breeding plans).

I want to go and live at the end of a very long lane...

Saucery · 02/10/2019 19:01

Gender Neutral Dogs Grin Grin Grin

“Ignore zie if zie humps your leg. Zie is exploring zie’s sexual orientation. Last week zie identified as a sofa cushion”

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 02/10/2019 19:33

@saucery
Grin Grin

MyOtherProfile · 03/10/2019 08:12

Well what a revelation this thread has been. There I am, busy producing my acrylic afghans in peace and harmony, totally oblivious to how political the yarnie world really is. Guess I was too busy with my head down looking at my stitches.

Makes me feel slightly sick and annoyed people have created such a mess in an otherwise peaceul world.

opinionatedfreak · 03/10/2019 08:29

I'm a knitter.

I hate all this craziness and am so sad for Kate Davies. Must remember to order the book I want as my LYS no longer stocks her stuff.

Ultimate irony though I spoke to a Yarn store owner who is not white. The madness has terrified herasshe is constantly worried she will say the wrong thing and her business will suffer.

SnuggyBuggy · 03/10/2019 08:44

I couldn't hack this, I'm pretty good at knitting but crap at making a convincing apology when I'm not sorry.

Saucery · 03/10/2019 10:10

I have wondered what BAME business owners think about all this, opinionatedfreak. I didn’t want to speak for them as it’s not only the vocal SJWs who think that’s not appropriate. But it must be horrible to wonder if you’ve got your business featured because of a misplaced tokenism rather than the quality of what you sell?
I’m sticking to businesses who have resisted all this nonsense. A simple statement of equality is fine and there is a place in the Yarn World for more inclusion without a doubt, but anyone taking part in the witch-hunt for no reason can whistle for my disposable income. They certainly aren’t making any space at shows or in shops for marginalised groups, you’ll notice.

Only wanting to talk about the knitting is a valid stance for customers and businesses.

lazylinguist · 03/10/2019 21:40

My Kate Davies book has arrived. I feel a bit out of my depth - a beginner's book it is not! . Better order some of her lovely yarn to make something from the book.

FlaviaAlbia · 03/10/2019 22:23

Ooh, which one did you get?

I've been hovering over the checkout button for Shore tonight, but my lys might have it in stock...

OffTheShelfElf · 04/10/2019 13:21

Love this thread. I've been watching events unfold with horror, because whilst I agree that the yarn world must become more inclusive, I don't agree with everything that has been said/done. Yet it seems that if you disagree with or question anything at all, then you're tone-policing. The polarisation of the community is ridiculous. There's no nuance, no middle ground. Surely you CAN hate the racism in the knitting world and want to reduce that racism without agreeing with every single word said on the matter? In the same way, I'm very strongly pro-remain in the Brexit debate, but I can still disagree with some of what other remainers have said or done.

But this thread is the only place where I dare say these things. I've been a coward on my Instagram and blog, and not said anything at all. After the Sockmatician thing blew up, I 'liked' one very moderately supportive comment on his Insta. Just because of that, quite a lot of people stopped following me. I daren't openly talk about the issue because unless you parrot the accepted script exactly, you're assumed to be some rabid racist.

How are we ever going to come together and heal if we can't even look at each other?

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 04/10/2019 15:08

I thought this article which Richard Dawkins tweeted was very apposite.

wigglybeezer · 04/10/2019 16:18

I've been enjoying this thread too, two of my world's coming together, even if it's for an unpleasant reason. It's been good to know others share my misgivings.

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 04/10/2019 17:53

I made the white chocolate and cardamom tablet today btw wiggly. I'm very much a sassenach and am a bit worried I didn't get the texture right, but it tastes

wigglybeezer · 04/10/2019 18:04

Yes tablet mixing can be quite tricky, my mum always uses a hand held electric mixer to do the beating, scraping the crumbs out of the pan is a nice cooks perk. I haven't made it for a few years but usually make it at Xmas, might have to do a practice run ...

AncientLights · 04/10/2019 18:12

What is this tablet you are all making? I first thought it was knitting-related but then cardamom? Please put me out of my misery.

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wigglybeezer · 04/10/2019 18:25

Scroll back up thread and all will be revealed, we did a typical Mumsnet thing and got diverted from discussing cultural appropriation by sharing recipes.

2Rebecca · 04/10/2019 18:31

Is there really racism in the yarn world, or is it mainly that a lot of knitting is by north European countries and areas like the Shetland Isles and the Fair Isles and Iceland because they are colder?

truthisarevolutionaryact · 04/10/2019 18:52

What an unbelievable and sad tale. Still - I have reconnected with my old knitting skills and the Truth household are placing an order with KD's lovely website.

It's just a small token but I am continually enraged at the current systematic bullying of good people by those who should know better.

wigglybeezer · 04/10/2019 18:54

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/2019/oct/04/extinction-rebellion-race-climate-crisis-inequality
They've turned their attention to Extinction Rebellion now, however I liked Benjamin Zephaniahs input at the end of the article.

2Rebecca · 04/10/2019 19:58

I like some of Zephaniah's poetry but saying "we" should take our steel bands and sound systems down sounds fairly stereotyping.

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