Trudeau and double standards

[Artesia]

Apparently Justin Trudeau has apologised for photos which have emerged of him with “blackface” make up. I am dying for someone to ask him why donning a costume and make up to mimic another race is offensive and worthy of apology, yet dressing up in “woman face” and demanding to be given full women’s rights should be applauded as stunning and brave.

My working class parents stopped me from dressing up my little brother as a "golly" for a fancy dress party in the mid 80s.

If they knew black face was in appropriate then, the son of a former prime minister bloody well knew too 15 years later. He just didn't care.

It's not that it wasn't considered offensive, it's that the definition of blackface was narrower, and the way it was seen to be offensive wasn't on quite the same basis, either. It's pretty specifically minstrel type blackface that was seen as negative, and largely because it was mocking. But if you had some 25 year old university students in 2001 watch Lawrence of Arabia, they would likely not be worked up that Alec Guinness was playing Faisal, but if you did it today, it would be a different story.

Blackface went out in the early 80s, surely?

Anyway he is a mewling hypocrite, and I’m absolutely loving his new look of “woke-scold hoisted on his own petard”.

Agree 64s.The idea that 'blackface' was ok in 2001 is laughable - anyone who claims to be anti-racist wouldn't have done that in the 80s. As anti-racist teens were disgusted by the blacked up Morris dancers in our rural area. (it wasn't an ancient tradition they dressed in American football outfits)

I've just had the same rant at my husband.

ha ha, and I had the rant at my sister when she said "What was he thinking?". So I had a rant about the situation in Canada which has been aided and abetted by his wonderful inclusivity.

Always the feet of clay, with these more-liberal-and-lovely-than-thou people.

As anti-racist teens were disgusted by the blacked up Morris dancers in our rural area.

I thought that was something to do with Moorish slavers? It's a very vague association in my mind though, could be wrong. Barbary slavers operated around the coast of Britain and Ireland in the 16th century.

Blackface has only been understood to be offensive in recent years.

A supposedly liberal man would not have cheerfully blacked up in this century, which is what he did. Anyone defending this using some nonsense 'different time' bullshit needs to ask themselves if they would defend it if it was a picture of, say a Republucan American doing the same thing in the same time period. If not, you are just excusing the unacceptable because Trudeau is on your team, and that's just shitty tribalist hypocrisy.

I lived in Belgium in 2001 and remember being very shocked by the Black Peter character they have there at Christmas (which is someone theatrically blacked up) - it was definitely not seen as generally ok!

It's almost as offensive as watching the cognitive dissonance going on as so many leftwingers dance on the head of a pin to make excuses for him.
It was in the past apparently.
The fact he was a 29 yr old teacher and not a teenager doesn't seem to matter.
I'm sure they would say the same if it was Trump getting exposed like this.
Mmm.
Its three occasions now and he is refusing to say if that is it, or anything else might come to light.

Anyone defending this using some nonsense 'different time' bullshit needs to ask themselves if they would defend it if it was a picture of, say a Republucan American doing the same thing in the same time period. If not, you are just excusing the unacceptable because Trudeau is on your team, and that's just shitty tribalist hypocrisy.

I'm not sure that's quite what's been said. And it's pretty cleat that Trudeau doesn't seem to be popular here generally.

"wee woke wanker"

Three words which sum up the whole debacle beautifully.

t's not that it wasn't considered offensive, it's that the definition of blackface was narrower, and the way it was seen to be offensive wasn't on quite the same basis, either. It's pretty specifically minstrel type blackface that was seen as negative, and largely because it was mocking. But if you had some 25 year old university students in 2001 watch Lawrence of Arabia, they would likely not be worked up that Alec Guinness was playing Faisal, but if you did it today, it would be a different story.

Exactly, that's what I mean. You've explained it better.

I was in an African country in 2011 and was blacked up the family I was staying in as part of a fancy dress evening. They thought it was hilarious, and I had no idea at the time it was offensive despite being from a 'well-educated', 'liberal' background. And if those pictures were to surface now I would be crucified, but at the time and in that context it just wasn't seen as wrong because it wasn't done to mock or offend.

Juells not these Morris dancers they were dressed as black US footballers in an area hundreds of miles from the sea.

Trudeau has shafted indigenous Canadians with the Trans Mountain pipeline too, he's a hypocrite of the highest order.

2001: Trudeau does blackface.
2018: Trudeau does Indianface.

He doesn't seem to learn does he?

20??: Trudeau does womanface.

at the time and in that context it just wasn't seen as wrong because it wasn't done to mock or offend.

Right.

The event Trudeau was at was a dress-up party with an Arabian Nights theme, that's the context. People were supposed to dress up like characters from The Arabian Nights. The whole thing wouldn't go over today, but it obviously did then and lots of people were there. Arabian type costumes weren't uncommon at that point, you still had plenty of little girls dressing up as the Disney Princess from Aladdin at that point which is now controversial and generally not done. I remember going to a Halloween party around that tie with a bellydancer costume, and a pregnant nun with a priest.

What was the context for blacking up and singing Day-O? Or the weird video of him blacked up?
I'm with SonEtL frat-boy.

No idea about the other one, really. But my point was simply that the sense of what that means has changed, it includes more things, and the reason people think it is problematic is often different, too.

Identity politics have substantial changed the way people think about this, it's now seen as an offence against identity, which is not how most people understood it at the turn of the millennium.

I think loads of people had realised by 2001 that this was dodgy. But others, within particular enclaves, still thought is was fine. What this tells us is the world Trudeau inhabited and it's fair to assume still inhabits to some degree. That's what he's desperate to shut this down.

It's pretty similar to Prince Harry dressing as a Nazi for a laugh. Everyone in his world thought it was hilarious. Many outside saw arrogance and privilege.

Black face was absolutely not ok in 2001. He’s a dick.

The marvellous thing about this is that had these photos emerged of a political opponent, Trudeau and his allies would have taken the greatest delight possible in using the photos to destroy the opponent. They would have been merciless.

But right now we're being told that because Trudeau is on the right side of history, all of this must be disregarded because, well, it's Trudeau, he's a good guy. In other words, you don't look at what people do, the only thing that counts is how identify. Like Yaniv.

Plus the positioning of his hands in that photo gives me the horrors. Who the hell puts their hand on a woman's chest like that?

actually frat boy sums it up perfectly well.
i was involved in costumes and shows and in 2001, where i was in canada, make up to play the part would have not caused anyone to bat an eye.
not much different than andrew shear's position on homophobia from the 1990's or before.
different times different places different things were seen as okay.
but i still don't like JT and his politics of spending.

This is Trudeau's world:

postmediatorontosun.files.wordpress.com/2019/09/jt-kevin-spacey-2.jpg

He's the one on being on the right side of history.