The Phillip Lee defection and the Lib Dems

[RedToothBrush]

Jessica elgot@jessicaelgot
The chair of the LGBT Lib Dems has resigned in protest of Philip Lee's acceptance into the party

This is Jennie Rigg.

They've just posted their resignation from the party.

What a shame.

Also the fuckwitted Radical Association have gone into complete meltdown.

Radical Association @radicalassoc
Fundamentally Philip Lee isn't a liberal and we are disappointed that he has been allowed to join the Lib Dems - a move that has already caused resignations of senior & long standing voices within our movement.

This is not in any way a good day for liberalism in the UK.

We will be considering our further response to this; we believe we were right to oppose Lee joining, and will consider ways to officially express that in the coming weeks. We are very sorry and sad to see resignations of great liberals occurring as a result of today.

We will be considering our further response to this; we believe we were right to oppose Lee joining, and will consider ways to officially express that in the coming weeks. We are very sorry and sad to see resignations of great liberals occurring as a result of today.

If you know the back history of this, then the radical association don't understand what liberalism is and are utter fuckwits but hold a substantial amount of influence in the party.

Jennie Rigg going is interesting. And I think having another MP is going to outweigh any amount of wailing this lot are going to do.

I do not not agree with them on everything (I think it unhealthy to anyway).

It's the principles of Liberal democracy and evidence based policy making and proper consultation that are the big deal to me.

This encompasses human rights, ethics, safeguarding and best practice if those principles are actually understood.

Twitter suggesting Luciana Berger will contest Finchley & Golders Green.

Slightly off topic but, LoveGrowsWhere I looked at some of the tweets on the link you posted. Someone posted this about Jo Swindon's vote record. She voted pretty consistently for benefits cuts (Luciana voted against). This is a feminist issue. I've seen a number of threads on here discussing the impact these cuts have had on women, including those fleeing domestic abuse.

Thyme thanks. As a feminist I feel compelled to vote but I have no idea who would get my vote if it was GE tomorrow. Desperately hoping for a good independent?

I don't want to vote Conservative and certainly not for the one in my constituency, but DP is Jewish. It's seeing the fear his parents have of Corbyn as PM that will make me vote Tory. Otherwise I'd have voted for a decent independent.

I might consider voting LD again if they’ve got rid of Brown and Challenor.

Holy shit Thyme that's one fuck of an awful voting record for someone who's styling herself as the progressive saviour of the nation.

Fucking hell, who the hell do I vote for?

Sarah Brown etc had quite a lot of power within the Lib Dems, it's quite easy to gain power in a small floundering political party.

Agree with this. Quite easy to have personal friends that are high up, in such a small party, if you just put in some effort. I've only done some mid-level campaigning for them and have the leader of the council, a high-up strategy advisor, an MP and a member of the HoL in my phone contacts

I've never actually met Sarah, but she comes across as appallingly obnoxious on the LD Facebook groups, shutting down discussion and doing 'I'm so hideously oppressed, I can't bear to talk about it', and all the cuddly LDs pussyfoot around her. She's managed to stop any discussion of women's sports/prisons etc with TRANSPHOBIA! so very few blokes in the party actually understand what the fuss is about and think it's just evil transphobic terfs etc

There's also still vocal opposition to AWS on the FB groups incidentally, they're sexist and we should just choose the best person for the job apparently.

I've had a look on theyworkforyou.com and I think Jo's votes on benefits are from the coaltiion years, probably all the Lib Dems' voting records from those years are hideous.

Obviously austerity was an appalling idea, and led directly to the Brexit shambles we're in today, but the democratic will of the country back then was to CUT EVERYTHING NOW, so there's an argument to be made that it was the right thing to do, even though it was clearly the wrong thing to do.

What's that quote? "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." (Starting to feel that way about Brexit TBH)

Billith absolutely, most are from the coalition years. I really struggle with all the criticism of the coalition and blaming of the LibDems. To me, they provided moderation to the Tories, and I think about how much worse things would have been without them. It does not mean everything was rosy or that I agree with everything they voted along with. But, on some things their hands were tied and they had to compromise.

www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1174965/Brexit-news-latest-Liberal-Democrats-vote-remain-LGBT-Phillip-Lee-Tory-revolt-no-deal

Lib Dem chaos: Swinson’s party in turmoil as key officials resign over ‘anti-Brexit party’

The Express seems to think that Jennie, Sarah and Zoe are 'key officials' and that their resignations mean the party is in turmoil. How bizarre.

Re Swinson's voting record dating back to the coalition years: what this tells me is that she put political ambition, party unity and the pursuit of power above principle.

I hate this revisionist history that's growing up (driven by the need to support an anti Brexit party and thus airbrush out their past crimes) that the Lib Dems went into the coalition to water down Cameron's "screw the poor" conservativism". They went into it because Clegg saw it as his only chance of power ever. And his party including Swinson knowingly went along with it.

The voters at the time saw right through it which is why they were annihilated at the next election. If it hadn't been for reinventing themselves as the anti Brexit party they would have been in the political wilderness for a generation.

The Express seems to think that Jennie, Sarah and Zoe are 'key officials' and that their resignations mean the party is in turmoil. How bizarre.

I notice no pictures of these "key officials".

Agree, Barbara - but given one of my main problems with the current Labour Party is the utter refusal to compromise any ideological purity at all in order to gain power and ACTUALLY BE ABLE TO ACHIEVE SOMETHING, I'm not sure it's entirely a bad thing.

Agree Burnernamechange & *BarbaraStrozzi (I do love your user name - what a role model for women and a gorgeous composer) that this is a huge problem for voters.

Thanks for links to Daily Express article EveryLittleAlps. I Suppose as a very pro Brexit newspaper, it is is bound to want to play up the ‘turmoil’ in the Lib Dems. Mind you, the quote about other factors as well as Philip Lee is intriguing. I will be watching to see if anything else changes. The point made upthread about the power individuals and pressure groups can wield in small political parties is so right. Sarah and Zoe (I’d not heard of Jennie before) did seem to have a very combative approach, for example, towards Anne Sinnott. I am not sure there will be many tears about their departure.

"It wasn't even just about Lee. There were bigger issues at play - the parliamentary party not talking to LGBT+ for years, deselecting LGBT+ candidates, not dealing with disciplinary cases."

And what about all the complaints raised against the LGBTLD twitter people that the LDs did nothing about?

Where all these disciplinaries to do with 'transphobia' and people they didn't like by any chance? I do wonder who has been deselected too? And why? Cos candidates tend to be selected by local associations unless there isn't someone putting their name forward and one is supplied by HQ and parachuted in.

Honestly to say they haven't talked about LGBT is hilarious!!!! What did Ed Davey do on his webchat here? And Jo Swinson chanting TWAW and Layla Moran with her woo woo quasi religious crap?

Honestly I do hope that they don't return to the party and the LDs have taken note of all the complaints made directly to HQ and to local associations.

I know they know about them right to the top. I know it's been discussed.

It would be a massive step forward and perhaps some lesbians can have a say and the institutional homophobia in the Lds can be talked about...

They weren't best pleased about Ed Davey coming on to talk to the TRANSPHOBES!!1! on here either come to think of it.

she put political ambition, party unity and the pursuit of power above principle.

I agree. I know I seem like a hypocrite because I have to vote Conservative (DP is Jewish) but I console myself by thinking at least the Tories are honest about not caring about vulnerable, sick, disabled people. Better than fake concern from Lib Dems like Swinson. Also, whilst likely for the wrong reasons, I do see the Tories as more likely than the others to look into the issue of single sex spaces - toilets, refuges, prisons, sports.

The young liberals part of the party tweeted this last night.

Look at no5.

Can someone explain to me why it's such a high priority and how it will help me and my family because I find this particularly insulting given the way the trans bullshit has destroyed mine.

It's ludicrous Red, but then Sarah 'suck my balls' Brown was at the top of the party's list of great Lib Dem women not that long ago.
The men in the party i.e. majority don't give a shit about women's rights, and the high-profile women in the party are so obsessed about claiming the same-sex marriage act as a Lib Dem legacy that they will put their name down for anything that is sold to them as progressive and vaguely LGB-related.

Sarah 'suck my balls' Brown was at the top of the party's list of great Lib Dem women not that long ago.

They seem to have run out of the t-shirts online. They must have been very popular? Not so much the green and purple suffragette ones as they are still available.

Nice to see that "tackle gender inequality" just scrapes in at 87. Though that probably more means trans too.

Oh for fucks sake. Number 5 in the political priorities, and with a completely vacuous assertion. Can any Lib Dem’s or anyone else please describe what rights do trans people currently not have, relative to anyone else, please?

Number 5 in the political priorities

This list is just a total jumble - why can’t it be organised into themes? It looks like something from a brainstorming meeting.

The list also includes ending the spousal veto. I’d be interested to know if they have consulted trans widows about this.

The list also includes ending the spousal veto. I’d be interested to know if they have consulted trans widows about this.

Good question.

I'd like to see transitioning as acceptable grounds for a fast-track divorce, personally. Other options (dissolving/annulling the marriage) leave women in a legal no-man's land regarding things like division of hte assets, maintenance, etc.