Mum refused emergency contraception. Because pharmacist doesn’t agree with it. Grrr.

[Evenquieterlife33]

I cannot get my head around this- if a medication is available for legal sale and use in the U.K no pharmacist should be imposing their personal beliefs on anybody and refusing to sell it to them. Absolute piss take in my opinion. It’s outrageous that this is legal. I have never heard of women being refused emergency contraception because it clashes with the pharmacists personal beliefs until I read this. I am got smacked. I bet I could find a pharmacist who doesn’t like to dispense antibiotics, I can’t see them being able to turn people away. The older I get the more of this shit seems to be visible. It’s either getting worse or I’ve had my eyes shut for a very long time.
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Totally unacceptable! It's scary how women's choices about their own bodies are still being restricted in this day and age.

A friend of mine living in London attends a catholic GP practice who won’t prescribe the pill or MAP.

Shouldn’t be allowed.

Same goes for other hcps choosing to go into general practice or even worse gynaecology and sexual health if they hold such beliefs

Question for any midwives - would you expect and consider it normal that as part of your work you might be required to advise on abortion?

I know that both times I've checked in with midwives, they've carefully and tactfully checked that I'm happy with the situation.

Nah, abortion and contraception is a basic human right. If you do not believe women should be allowed to access their basic and legal rights then you should not be allowed to take a role that makes you a gatekeeper.

Ridiculous that the law says something is fine but Mr Jones down the road refuses to comply because he doesn’t like it. Ridiculous that in an extreme scenario where every health professional in your village/town/city/country holds Mr Jones’ views then you cannot access your rights.

I think I read that in the US pharmacists can opt out of providing it, but if they do so they have to put a big notice to that effect up on the door, so that no one who is going to be refused gets as far as the counter.

Newhouse - if it's not a medical circ, why would people ask you to refer them in the first place?

I disagree with pharmacists being able to do this. However, if they are to be allowed to apply their moral views on a legally available drug, they should perhaps receive less pay than other pharmacists that do 100% of their role.

I had a similar situation with an on call GP. My coil decided it wanted to evict itself from my body, and I needed a MAP. The male GP initially refused to prescribe it, saying it wouldn't work due to it being close to 72 hours. I asked him about the MAP which is effective within 5 days. He said "why do you want one, you are married?".

What I didn't say, but thought, was "That is nothing to do with you and you are making a HUGE presumption that it was my husband that I had had sex with".

He did eventually prescribe after I asked him whether he was trying to say that I had no need of contraception DUE to being married, and that I should acquiesce to becoming pregnant because of this?

Joanna! “He said "why do you want one, you are married?". “

Omg my chin just hit the floor that’s unbelievable.
I’m the granddaughter of a catholic woman who gave birth to no less than 14 children. In the days where children were being snatched and deported from Liverpool’s poverty stricken families and sent away to the other side of the world. They lived in poverty because they were ruled over by priests. Contraception was “wrong.”
How the hell do men like your on call G.P get along in the modern world. We don’t need attitudes like that in any medical practice today it’s disgusting.

Devil’s avocado moment - is it a ‘discrimination against women’ issue? Men don’t need MAP, it’s not like it’s freely available for men but not women. Condoms are used/bought by both sexes.

Actually (think I’ve told this story on here before) once my DP nipped to the pharmacy to get me MAP as we’d had a condom split, and I was actually quite poorly with a bad cold (gross sick person sex ) so didn’t want to go out. He was unable to get it for me, even though you can get other over-the-counter items like cocodamol and antibiotic eye drops for other people. The look on the pharmacists face when snot-ridden dishevelled me shuffled in an hour later to ask for the MAP he wouldn’t/couldn’t sell my OH was a picture.

It’s clearly a women’s rights issue (important one) & part of women’s reproductive healthcare, but is it technically discrimination, I’m not sure.

Hmm - I think it does qualify. If you restrict access to a medicine that a group needs because you don’t like it (- not forgetting that women are a protected class,) , then you are discriminating against them. You are causing them inconvenience, possible pregnancy, danger in some cases and risk to their physical and mental health.
If the U.K. Gov said any shops etc that already have disabled toilets don’t have to allow customers to use them for personal reasons then it would be discriminatory. The fact that another person holds a view based on religion shouldn’t over rise someone’s right to healthcare.
This is the problem with allowing opt out for medicines based on faith, it allows the person of faith to impose their view upon any woman ( not man.) in so far as the very least damage to her is embarrassment anger and inconvenience. It is still damage. I would say because this can only ever effect women, and because women are a protected class there should be special law surrounding the dispensing of MAP. I don’t buy that 1 persons offence should outway another persons freedom.

I can understand why the pharmacist would refuse to sell it to a man.

Sorry override not rise.

Yeah I can too Lass, at the time I was just hopeful and was proper poorly on the sofa not wanting to go out.

Hi I'm a pharmacist and come from a religion where abortion isn't allowed. HOWEVER I do not refuse to sell EHC. I believe I need to do my job and like others have said this is time sensitive and I am always willing and happy to provide this service and have done so many a time. HOWEVER if someone wishes not to, I think it is up to them and like a lot of services they will sign post to the nearest point where it is available.
I do not like how this is being compared to providing prayer rooms etc for ppl. Totally unrelated and just shows what ppl really think of religious ppl.

@blissfullyignorantorinpain but what if the nearest service that will provide it, is miles away? What happens if that woman can't drive? If it's a teenager who has come out during her school break? A woman who can't get time off work to get the three buses to the next pharmacy.

Do you really think it's right that a pharmacist's religious belief should be imposed on a woman who doesn't share it - and who is simply seeking a legal medicine? Personal religious beliefs are just that - personal. It's completely unethical to impose them on others without their consent and to their detriment.

@ControversialFerret exactly! What if she is vulnerable, young, unable to support a baby, for health reasons the pregnancy would not be good or simply she just does not want a baby in which case it would be unfair on her and the baby. And these are the reasons I happily provide this service like I said. And I DO NOT agree with those who don't BUT like with a lot of things in life you can't force ppl to change their opinions even if they are unfair to others.

I would only hope the service could be provided close by as usually there are quite a few pharmacies in close proximity. Nevertheless the pharmacists duty of not providing the service at the very least find a local close chemist that can provide it and phone the chemist beforehand and make sure they have the product in stock and a pharmacist who will provide it!

“I do not like how this is being compared to providing prayer rooms etc for ppl. Totally unrelated and just shows what ppl really think of religious ppl.”

I think the reason is because providing a prayer room helps a person to exercise their religious right to prayer when people need to pray during work hours. This has no impact on anybody else’s health or Safety and is a great thing. Allowing pharmacists to exercise their religious rights under the equality act when refusing to dispense means that conversely a girl or woman’s right to health care and to medicine that may enable her to determine her own future could be lost. This has nothing to with what people think of people who have faith, it has to do with one persons faith not dictating a women’s health. If the number of people who actively object and refuse increases it becomes an obstacle for more and more women and girls. This shouldn’t be the case.

Oh this thread is winding me up! I work in pharmacy, and have worked with pharmacists who will not prescribe emergency contraception for religious / moral reasons. They are perfectly within their right to do so and I support their choice. These pharmacists will always ensure that the patient receives the medication they need at another pharmacy locally, indeed standard practice is to phone a nearby pharmacy, explain the situation and make an appointment for the patient. They are NEVER left to fend for themselves.

Secondly, this is not a feminist issue. This is not persecution of women. These pharmacists believe that life begins at conception. If they provide emergency contraception they risk ending 'a life', and that is against their beliefs. Which they are entitled to.

Lastly, these pharmacists will still sell condoms, and provide contraceptives, because there is no 'risk to life' as they see it. Again, not a feminist issue.

Expecting to be flamed for not seeing this for the patriarchal oppression it so clearly is, but I do not believe in excluding highly qualified, empathetic and caring pharmacists from a profession when emergency contraception is such a tiny tiny aspect of the role.

Also as pharmacists we are not legally allowed to sell it to anyone who is not actually taking the EHC, be it a man or another woman. The woman who wants the EHC has to present so we can ask all the relevant medical questions and get consent. And from a duty of care point of view make sure there isn't cases of abuse, rape etc.

@Evenquieterlife33 but it's not dictating a woman's health. From their point of view it's playing with fate and "a life". The prayer room would not impact anyone else, however if a pharmacist or anyone did anything they believed was against their religion it would obviously be quite hard and upsetting for them so it's different. And like I said and other pp have said the client would NEVER and should NEVER be left to fend for herself if a pharmacist refuses a service no matter what service that would be. They would call the nearest pharmacy and make sure they got them seen or even refer them to a local surgery as a lot of pharmacy's are near surgeries where there are a lot of Drs or nurses who could provide this service.

This happened to a friend of mine last year

The pharmacy was in a branch of Boots

That’s a Boots pharmacy which employs a pharmacist who refuses women this

BOOTS

I no longer shop at Boots, because they employ people who discriminate against women

I work in a hair salon and no longer recommend products sold exclusively at or made exclusively by Boots to my clients. I often tell them what happened as well (you’d be surprised at what people confide in you when you’re doing their hair) so they know not to bother going to Boots in identical or similar situations.

I urge others not to shop at Boots either

Superdrug is far better anyway, all their own brand products are cruelty free

Unlike BOOTS who seem to hate animals almost as much as they hate women

Anyone unsure of the name of the pharmacy where my friend was refused emergency contraception please feel free to pm me :)

‘Secondly, this is not a feminist issue.’

Women’s access emergency contraception is a feminist issue. Women having to go elsewhere to get a legal, medically appropriate treatment because the chemist declines to do their because of their religious beliefs is a feminist issue.

‘emergency contraception is such a tiny tiny aspect of the role.’

It’s everything to the women who need it at the time they need it. The memory of the panic of trying to get access to it in time is enough for me to see it as incredibly important. The cost, emotional, physical and financial, if the contraception is delayed is not ‘tiny.’ I’ve never cared which chemist I use. Next time I’m in to collect a prescription I’ll check if they provide the MAP. If they don’t I’ll swap to one that does.

These pharmacists will always ensure that the patient receives the medication they need at another pharmacy locally, indeed standard practice is to phone a nearby pharmacy, explain the situation and make an appointment for the patient. They are NEVER left to fend for themselves.

I have relatives all over the UK, some of them live in rural areas. In one case their other local pharmacy is 30 miles away. In an area where there are four buses a day between 9-6pm. If you don't drive you are completely stuck. Taxis cost the earth and aren't readily available (the local cab service has one car!). So please do explain how a woman in this situation is supposed to be sympathetic to a pharmacist's conscientious objection?

Secondly, this is not a feminist issue. This is not persecution of women
How is it not? It only affects females. They are directly disadvantaged by being denied access to a legal medicine.

These pharmacists believe that life begins at conception. If they provide emergency contraception they risk ending 'a life', and that is against their beliefs. Which they are entitled to.
And what if being pregnant is a threat to the woman's life - or does that not count? In relation to risking ending a life, doesn't the MAP prevent ovulation, meaning that conception doesn't take place? How is that any different to preventing sperm from meeting egg by using a condom?

They can be as entitled as they like to their religious beliefs - and if they don't agree with the MAP then they shouldn't take it themselves. But it's legal in the UK and as a qualified pharmacist they should be obliged to dispense it.

They’re refusing to sell a specific item rather than refusing to sell an item because it’s woman buying it. Which would be illegal. Principle is the same as the cake maker refusing to make a pro-gay cake that’s recently been in and out of court.

Though I do agree that that shouldn’t be doing the job if they can’t do all the job.