Gender free non binary man swim

[VeniceAllan]

I went to the Highgate Men's Bathing Pond on Hampstead Heath and so should you!

Here are my thoughts before and after

Amazing work! Thank you Venice for making the point that needs to be made. Xx

I had no idea the men's was warmer. And I'm sure most women don't know that.

Knowing that they will be swimming in a far warmer pool is going to be very encouraging to gender free non-binary men who also want to highlight this sensitive issue.

Well done Venice...but of course it is not really equivalent as we are not likely to actually threaten the men. But you made your point.

How lovely, it's a sensitive issue when it's men's spaces being invaded.

But how was the life guard able to tell her apart from all the other men in the pool? It's a mystery

I think men need to be as inconvenienced as we are. Single sex should mean just that, especially when there is a mixed pond

Funny that the males who think they are women don't get told to use the mixed sex pool.

The other way this can be looked at though surely- is she was accepted and allowed to swim in the men's pool as her chosen 'gender' so equally no complaining can be made as and when a man does the same. It has to work both ways. Either you are making a point and 'invading' male spaces as female spaces are being, or you work towards trying to ensure both spaces are protected. All this proves is that by identifying as that gender, you can access a space previously only sex specific.

or you work towards trying to ensure both spaces are protected.

How do you suggest we go about doing this? I assume you have some ideas about how to achieve this.

All this proves is that by identifying as that gender, you can access a space previously only sex specific.

Well, yes.

Something that has historically only upset women, so has been allowed/encouraged.

Upsetting men generally has a swift and conclusive reaction.

So let's have it.

@Datun- I agree with your point- but no man was upset- apart from the lifeguard who also gave up and allowed it. There was no outrage or complaints. Although I also understand this was only one occasion, and would be interested if they or others regularly attended the male baths and if it caused any issue. Also would be interested in how many men who identified as women attend the female specific baths. I get that conceptually it 'can' happen- and that's my issue. I want sex specific places- not gender specific. I want this for me and my daughter. I am also interested though in the specifics and numbers of those of the opposite sex who have identified as a different gender who actually attend sex specific places as their chosen gender. Because I like facts, and the ability to give them to others when I'm trying to explain why sex should continue to be a protected characteristic but gender shouldn't, if that makes sense?

Yes it makes sense SD1978.

I believe this all started after a transwoman insisted on using the ladies' pond. And then Man Friday pushed the issue by using the men's to raise awareness. And the police were called.

And now Edward Lord has decided to make all three ponds mixed sex. I think Edward assumes it will only be women who object.

It won't be.

How can we possibly know how many men are swimming at the ladies pond? I have seen them there several times.

I am also interested though in the specifics and numbers of those of the opposite sex who have identified as a different gender who actually attend sex specific places as their chosen gender.

You might find this thread informative, SD1978.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3348290-It-will-never-happen-resource-thread

The ladies pond is so idyllic and peaceful, had no idea the men's was warmer! This is all a power play isn't it? Trans women, aka men, have no reason to feel afraid at the men's pond as it's a largely gay and peaceful space. Gay men aren't known for going around beating people up.
It's all just validation and control, including deciding 1000s of responses were invalid.

I feel sorry for the lifeguards at the Ladies Pond. How do they differentiate between a real translady (man) or a man just taking advantage of the new rules? Should we get all our male friends and family to head to the Ladies Pond one day, insisting they're women, and film the ridiculousness of it?

Rolling my eyes that it’s you “cheapening a sensitive issue”.

The men who have been invading the women’s pond are, of course, deeply sensitive and utterly innocent.

His comments to you are “literal violence”.

I don't think we should bring men to the Ladies' pond. I think we need to bring this issue to the men and get them to change the policy.

I love the way you confided to the recording that "I'm not really a man".

Well done, brother. Gender free non binary men have rights to swim too.

More women should definitely do this.
*VeniceAllen"
Really you've seen men swimming at the ladies pond loads?
I thought the rules were only changed recently...

Also more questions

If we/men/the general public DO object to the change in the rules, who specifically do you contact?

Allan. Thanks bro for the vid.

Now, how many other men did you see at the pond in total, and how many other men approached and questioned you.

I got that there were 2 men swimming, one official and yourself. And of those 3 other men, all 3 approached you?

Men dressed as women have been going to the pond on the sly forever, I expect. They confirmed they were trans inclusive last year and then commissioned a consultation and recently updated the policy to clarify their position.

I don't think we should bring men to the Ladies' pond. I think we need to bring this issue to the men and get them to change the policy.

Concur. Men, who are under no physical threat from this, nor any threat of being subject to voyeurism, seem to think it's absolutely fine to object on the basis simply of I don't like it. This, coming from women, is apparently clear evidence of bigotry.

There were about 10 guys in the changing/sunbathing area. I don't know about the nude sunbathing as I didn't go in there! While I was swimming about 5 men got in the pool and there were 2 lifeguards.

While I was swimming about 5 men got in the pool and there were 2 lifeguards.

Sorry for being picky, I was just interested in the stats of how many that actually saw you decided to say something. As opposed to those that just didn't realise [they were in the presence of Allan Venice - OMG - ahem - as you were].