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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Independent Inquiry into Child sexual abuse investigates David and Aimee Challenor

88 replies

EweSurname · 14/03/2019 10:33

Live stream here:

www.iicsa.org.uk/live

OP posts:
BeUpStanding · 14/03/2019 12:49

Cross-posted again!

Thanks R0, that's good to know.

truthisarevolutionaryact · 14/03/2019 12:55

That repellant politician Boris Johnson made some vile remarks about the enquiry:
www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/13/boris-johnson-under-fire-over-remarks-about-child-abuse-inquiries

And on the same day David Steel disclosed that he knew about Cyril Smith's paedophile activities but took no action whatsoever:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cyril-smith-admitted-to-abuse-claims-says-former-liberal-leader-rh3mbwf09?shareToken=b960e3ccf3358cfc83d18a0dabbc3703

No wonder child abuse is so prevalent in the UK with this lot in charge.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 12:58

Savile stuff very interesting at the moment.

R0wantrees · 14/03/2019 13:05

Yes the investigation will conclude with a report and recommendations... Not sure how much 'teeth' the iicsa have though for ensuring recommendations get implemented

The history of Safeguarding framework key developments illustrates this:

When there is a major incident eg the abuse and deaths of Maria Colwell,Victoria Climbie, Holly Wells and Jessicca Chapman, Peter Connolly the ensuing reviews led to significant understandings of the framework failings and therefore potentially more robust Child Protection and Safeguarding informed by legislation.

NSPCC History of Child Protection:
1945
The first formal child death inquiry in England was the Curtis Committee Report into the death of Dennis O'Neill, who was killed at the age of 12 by his foster father.

1973
The death of 7-year-old Maria Colwell led to the establishment of our modern child protection system.

1984
Further changes were prompted partly by the inquiries into several other child deaths, including 4-year-old Jasmine Beckford.

1989
The Children Act 1989 established the legislative framework for the current child protection system in England and Wales.

1995
The Children (Northern Ireland) Order 1995 and the Children (Scotland) Act 1995 established the legislative framework for the current child protection systems in Northern Ireland and Scotland.

2000
The death of 8-year-old Victoria Climbie led to Lord Laming’s report (2003) which led to sweeping changes to the way children's services were structured in England and Wales.

2001
The Children's Commissioner for Wales Act 2001 created the first children’s commissioner post in the UK.

2002
The deaths of 10-year-olds Holly Wells and Jessica Chapman in Soham led to the strengthening of legislation across the UK to protect children from adults who pose a risk to them.

2004
The Children Act 2004, informed by Lord Laming’s report, established a Children’s Commissioner in England (the last of the UK nations to appoint one); created Local Safeguarding Children's Boards (LSCBs) in England and Wales; and placed a duty on local authorities in England to appoint a director of children’s services and an elected lead member for children’s services, who is ultimately accountable for the delivery of services.

2006
Scotland the Minister for Children published a review of the Children’s Hearing System, entitled Getting it right for every child (Creegan, C., Henderson, G., and King, C., 2006), highlighting a dramatic increase in identified children with multiple needs.

2008
The death of 1-year-old Peter Connelly led to further reviews of social service care in England by Lord Laming, with the House of Commons debating the case.

2009
Lord Laming’s The protection of children in England: a progress report (2009), ordered following the Peter Connelly case, makes 58 recommendations for child protection reforms.

2010
The new Secretary of State for Education, Michael Gove, commissioned Professor Eileen Munro to conduct an independent review of child protection in England.

2010
Minister for Children and Families Tim Loughton announced that Local Safeguarding Boards in England should publish the overview report and executive summary of all case reviews initiated on or after 10 June 2010.

2011
Professor Munro’s report A child-centred system (2011) set out recommendations to “help to reform the child protection system from being over-bureaucratised and concerned with compliance to one that keeps a focus on children, checking whether they are being effectively helped, and adapting when problems are identified”.

The Safeguarding Board Act (Northern Ireland) 2011 set out the law for the creation of a new regional Safeguarding Board for Northern Ireland and the establishment of five Safeguarding Panels.

2012
Operation Yewtree was set up to investigate sexual abuse allegations against Jimmy Saville and others.

2013
The Independent review into child sexual exploitation in Rochdale examined the council’s response to issues around child sexual exploitation.

2013
A new version of Working Together to Safeguard Children was published in England, informed by the Munro review.

2014
The Social Services and Well-being (Wales) Act 2014 provided Wales with its own legislative framework for social services for children and adults.

Under Section 145 it gives powers to Welsh Ministers to issue codes of practice providing guidance, objectives and requirements on local authorities’ provision of social services.

2015
The Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse in England and Wales (IICSA) officially launched to consider the growing evidence of institutional failures to protect children from child sexual abuse.

The Children’s Services Co-operation Act (Northern Ireland) 2015 requires public authorities to contribute to the wellbeing of children and young people in regards to physical and mental health, learning and achievement and living conditions.

2016
The Football Association (FA) launched an internal review into child abuse following allegations of child abuse. The Scottish FA announced an independent inquiry.

2017
The Digital Economy Act 2017 extended protection from online pornography by allowing sites which display pornography to children to be blocked in the UK.

2018
An updated version of Working together to safeguard children (Department for Education, 2018) was published for England, replacing LSCBs with safeguarding partner arrangements."
learning.nspcc.org.uk/child-protection-system/history-of-child-protection-in-the-uk/

There will always be risk and tragic incidents however each time the framework is reviewed there is the opportunity to strengthen the protections for children and vulnerable adults.

AbsintheFriends · 14/03/2019 13:07

That remark made by Boris Johnson was as baffling as it was offensive and stupid. The only reason I can think of someone making such an argument is if they had something on their conscience.

AbsintheFriends · 14/03/2019 13:07

Not insinuating anything OF COURSE. Just speculating.

ThePurportedDoctoress · 14/03/2019 13:13

The greens are still trying to silence people within their party who try to object to other things connected the fall out of all this. It's a witch hunt.

I know a couple of people socially who are involved in their local Green party, and when I mentioned the Challenors to them, they claimed they hadn't even heard about the case! One of these people is very active in her local party and has stood in local elections.

rocketromano · 14/03/2019 13:17

I wonder if mainstream press will bother to report on this. The fact that DC was involved in policy decisions related to reducing safeguarding while carrying out the most despicable crimes against a young girl ... and that AC couldn’t see why this was a problem. It’s mindblowingly bad and needs sunlight and lots of it

caramelwaffle · 14/03/2019 13:19

Datun

I have nothing to do with mainstream politics i.e. Lab/Con/Lib/etc

This is to do with close friendships and small circles - including mine. No. They don't fear h. They protect h, and themselves. Because they are very vocal on SM and IRL. They HAVE TO stand with someone is wrong otherwise their whole identity, their whole life choices, their wholesale attack on women falters.

When people here post links to attacks on women, I actually look to see if I can recognise anyone behind the balaclavas.

One day they will wake to a knock on their door.

caramelwaffle · 14/03/2019 13:20
  • with someone who is wrong -
Datun · 14/03/2019 13:21

caramelwaffle

Right. So they are fully immersed in the ideology and accept that their ideology takes precedence over child safeguarding?

Are they trans?

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 13:22

I'm not surprised. The party is small and has a lot to loose.

I've been watching the inquiry; it's horribly fascinating and shocking how much was dismissed or ignored or not followed up on.

So much hiding in plain sight.

BeUpStanding · 14/03/2019 13:23

Thank you very much for that history of safeguarding framework key developments R0. Really useful to see how it all fits together.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 13:24

(In answer to thepurported)

caramelwaffle · 14/03/2019 13:24

There are other children involved. That is why I keep a careful watch n wait stance IRL.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 13:27

I wonder if mainstream press will bother to report on this. The fact that DC was involved in policy decisions related to reducing safeguarding while carrying out the most despicable crimes against a young girl ... and that AC couldn’t see why this was a problem. It’s mindblowingly bad and needs sunlight and lots of it

There may be whistle blowing in the future. I'm appalled at the attitudes I've heard about towards safeguarding and being accountable, and especially to those who are wanting to expose it and make sure nothing like that ever happens again.

R0wantrees · 14/03/2019 13:35

2015 The Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse in England and Wales (IICSA) officially launched to consider the growing evidence of institutional failures to protect children from child sexual abuse.

This is a really significant inquiry.
The Safeguarding failures are systemic and widespread.

see also important thread collating ongoing examples of how Safeguarding and Child Protection frameworks are failing/under pressure:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a3301266-Safeguarding-girls-and-protecting-women-post-Jimmy-Saville-metoo

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 14:45

Keep your self safe too caramel.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/03/2019 14:54

Thanks for the history R0 I actually hadn't realised that the majority of active modern day safeguarding practices were actually established relatively recently, ( around the time I trained in teaching) which puts a lot of things into perspective but also leads me to feel we are constantly 5 or more years behind.

This is especially with regards to more subtle types of grooming and abuse (grooming of the public especially) and online and media.

Angryresister · 14/03/2019 14:54

Thank you ROwantrees for your historical view of legislation around safeguarding of children. When did it suddenly turn into a control of the narrative by the tran lobby. Actually I know men have been actively working against the exposure of the links for ever, so apologies for the irrelevant question.

exposure of the links for years

andyoldlabour · 14/03/2019 15:16

I have read this thread so far, and I would just like to thank everyone for their contribution, because this and all the aother stuff I have read on MN since joining months ago, has really opened my eyes to the state of UK politics, the dirt, the cover ups, the intense lobbying and bullying by minority groups.

PeeGreen · 14/03/2019 16:08

Transcript here

www.iicsa.org.uk/key-documents/9870/view/public-hearing-transcript-14-march-2019.pdf

"She gifted him membership a year later.
19 Q. When you say "gifted him", what does that mean?
20 A. Well, you can do that. You can buy a membership on
21 behalf of somebody else, and I believe her relationship
22 with her father had not been a happy one, and this was
23 one of the ways of conciliating between them.
"

That's the first of heard of it. David & Aimee were very close!!! Aimee nominated David Challenor for a Virgin Trains 'my best father' competition. David Challenor posted rude reviews of the Bullring when Aimee threatened terrorist attacks on them. Aimee (then Ashton) ran he family's 'Social Services are against the Challenors, the Challenors will overcome' FB page.

"Did you understand that she was saying at that time that
2 she didn't know what the actual allegations were, but
3 that her father had been charged with 22 offences?"

Cross-reference here

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3486244-Radio-5-Live-interview-with-Aimee-Challenor?messages=100&pg=1

" I wasn't - I wasn't told the full nature of the charges."

" I was told that the police have released him on bail, and continued to release him on bail, which I think skewed my perception a bit. And obviously there's the familial skew of, it's my family, I have to stand by my family."

The first statement by Aimee appears deliberately meaningless. Nobody could know the 'full nature' of the charges. Aimee's contemporary social media postings suggest Aimee was quite aware of what was being alleged in terms of the victim and the nature of the charges.

Anyway, Aimee's deliberately vague BBC statement is most likely consistent with the one made to the Greens at the time, so it is Aimee that is most culpable here, which is convenient for the Green Party (though not so much for the Lib Dems).

Continuing in the IICSA today

"So David Challenor was expelled from the party with
23 immediate effect, and tell us -- I'm sorry if I missed
24 it -- what became of Amy at that point?
25 A. Amy and Tina were both given what we call a no-fault
suspension, and GPRC, the Green Party Regional Council,
2 immediately instigates a disciplinary process to
3 establish the facts.
4 Q. What happened in that disciplinary process?
5 A. Aimee resigned before the disciplinary process got under
6 way.
And resigned when? Do you remember? I don't want an
8 exact date, but how long after the disciplinary
9 process --
10 A. Very soon after"

They don't mention that the Green Party women put out a statement in support of Aimee during this suspension, which seemed to prejudice any investigation

www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1864624806987631&id=647628982020559

"In relation to the Challenor affair, has the party
16 received internal or external complaints about that
17 matter from party members or others?
I don't know how many people were -- approached the
19 party to ask what was going on or to say that it had
20 upset them, and, to be honest, I think that us
21 commissioning the Verita Report made people feel
22 comfortable that we were dealing with it in an
23 appropriate way.
But up to that point, were there complaints, either
25 internally or externally, about what had happened, and
perhaps --
2 A. Not that I'm aware of.
3 Q. You're not aware?
4 A. No.
5 Q. So you're not even aware if people may still be
6 complaining about it?
7 A. I don't think they are, but I'm quite happy to go back
8 and find out if --
9 Q. No, no, I'm simply asking. If it is necessary, we will
10 ask you to do so.
11 A. Yes.
12 Q. But I simply wanted to know, in general terms, whether
13 you were aware of any such complaints?
14 A. No.
15 Q. I'm not suggesting there are, I just want to ask if
16 there are, to your knowledge?
17 A. No."

Are you fucking kidding me?

It is my opinion that the lessons from the AC case is that while AC was and remains someone unsuited to politics, AC was identified as a 'rising star' for the sole reason that AC identifies as transgender. People who are not trans with Aimee's skills, personal hygiene, background, etc. would not achieve the same level of prominence.

The lesson should be that being transgender is not a reason to elect (or not) someone. See also Heather Peto and others, who have been given extraordinary allowances that would not be given to biological women.

The promotion of Aimee Challenor for the reason that Aimee is transgender caused the reputational damage to the Green Party. Then, the unwillingness to challenge people who identify as transgender, meant Aimee was not properly questioned when David was charged, and again further damage was caused.

The topic then moves on to an email from a woman in relation to a (different) Green candidate, saying she had been raped by him when he was a teacher. The name is redacted, but his identity is transparently obvious by a little Googling.

""I tell you now, you put [the name has been
9 redacted] forward as the MP candidate for [the location
10 has been redacted] or any other position of power
11 representing the Green Party

...

This man has an arrest record for
19 underage sex with young girls

...

I've just finished three months of rape counselling
21 to get over what he did to me when I was 15. I plan to
22 find the other girls I know of and encourage them to
23 come forward. [The person] is a serial paedophile

...

"The Green Party are complicit, you already know
16 about the allegations, which is why he was discreetly
17 deselected as deputy leader"

This email was sent 17 December 2014.

"this predates our disciplinary
9 system, so I'm afraid we can't tell you what happened to
10 it, but we have taken immediate action and we have
11 written to the member concerned and told him that we
12 will be asking for his immediate no-fault suspension,
13 which should happen today, while an independent
14 investigation is undertaken of the circumstances
15 described here"

So essentially this rather major person is accused of being a paedophile by a victim, and they say they don't have a copy of the email, and have no record of whether he was investigated

MillytantForceit · 14/03/2019 16:22

A quick Google and I found the name of the ex-deputy leader in seconds.

PeeGreen · 14/03/2019 16:24

well yes. they haven't had many.

PeeGreen · 14/03/2019 16:25

Wife half his age as well.

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