Why aren’t male athletes standing with their female counterparts?

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We have seen more and more female athletes come out to discuss TW in female sports and the matter of fairness and so far the only male athlete I have seen come out in support is Daley Thompson (good on him).

Where is the usually mouthy crisp snatcher on this matter?
Why aren’t they supporting their fellow sportspeople?

The silence is deafening.

Adam Duggleby (gold medallist Paralympian) has been criticizing RM and retweeting Sharron Davies. I would like to see Andy Murray speak out, he's always been an advocate for women's sport and Judy Murray is very close to Martina Navratilova.

LouiseCollins28

If it makes it easier for you, the issue is transwomen in all women’s sports. Women who play football are sportswomen and there is a handy catchall term for sportswomen and sportsmen. Do you know what it is? Yes, that right - athletes.

Louise the ideology is evil. No-one apart from you has said transwomen are evil.

I would assume because they don't care, don't think it's an issue, are misogynists, and are only interested in their own career/skin.

Maybe they’re nervous of being accused of mansplaining....
I also have my hopes pinned on Andy Murray, he has previously shown great respect for fellow women tennis players.

Oddly enough, on a feminism board you're quite likely to find people who think the erosion of women's and girl's rights is pretty evil.

The people doing the erosion may have all sorts of motivations - some it's merely ill-thought out 'inclusiveness', others its maybe simple self-interest.

Glad to see some sportsmen speaking out but I wish (and no offence to those who have) we could see some big names. I imagine a big name footballer wouldn’t get too much of a backlash from their fan base considering the reactions to the likes of Piers Morgan tweeting about his coverage this week. The usual female GC voices were drowned out by men new to the subject who immediately saw how unfair it all is.

I'm sure that 99% of sportsmen think exactly the same as 99% of the population, that it's absolutely daft that a biological male can compete against a female.

But look what happens if you state the obvious. Career and punditry/commentating opportunities down the pan and loss of sponsorship - and also the fear of being forever branded a bigot .

I know men don't generally don't give a shit about women

And

Because a lot of them are probably closest misogynists, that are secretly getting a thrill out of women losing out.

I think you need to choose the men in your life a little better if this is your opinion of them. I can see why many women in my life don't consider themselves feminists if this is what they associate with being a feminist.

"I can see why many women in my life don't consider themselves feminists if this is what they associate with being a feminist."

This is just anti-feminist nonsense. It's tedious and repetitive, always gets trotted out by someone who has an anti-feminist/anti-women agenda.

I am sure mostly they don't want to get the flack or have sponsorship threatened just like the many women who have not said anything, and the fact they (and their remembered boyhood self) won't be affected makes the decision easy. But I think there will also be the feeling that they'll be accused of mansplaining, stay in your lane, don't talk over women, and be criticised for being 'as a father of daughters' man.
I agree we need some retired sportsmen because male voices have traction - that's the culture we live in.

On football, wasn't there a report that the Iran women's football team had many tw players?

the fear of being forever branded a bigot .

Perhaps those of us who want to discuss this issue should keep reminding those who are shutting down debate what the definition of a bigot is:

bigot
/ˈbɪɡət
noun
a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.

The idea that if one poster expresses a view like that re men, that it therefore applies to all feminists (many of whom are happily married etc etc) really is a bit silly.

There are plenty of men who are getting a kick out of women being attacked by TRAs. You only have to read below the line on various news articles or youtube videos to see that. Whether that extends to any professional sportsmen I wouldn't like to say but we can't discount it as one of many possibilities.

This is just anti-feminist nonsense. It's tedious and repetitive, always gets trotted out by someone who has an anti-feminist/anti-women agenda.

I'm a woman, definitely no anti women agenda. I also don't have an anti men agenda as I have a male partner and son who do give a shit about women.

The idea that if one poster expresses a view like that re men, that it therefore applies to all feminists (many of whom are happily married etc etc) really is a bit silly.

Well no one on this thread told the 2 posters who made the statements that they were wrong. I never said it applied to all feminists but it's the ones who are saying it AND the ones who are not calling them out on it to say it's wrong who give feminists a bad name.

Everything any women who states she is a feminist does is used to "give feminism a bad name". It's ridiculous and used as a cheap shot.

I don't care what sex you are. Women and men can be anti-feminist and have anti-women agendas.

I personally have lovely men in my life but didn't bat an eyelid at the points that men generally don't give a shit about women and many are closet misogynists because of the massive number of gloaty tweets and news comments saying 'ha ha - well women wanted equality and here it is.'

Unfortunately, it's a position taken by many, many men on this. Weird that LouiseCollins hasn't noticed it.

I can see why many women in my life don't consider themselves feminists if this is what they associate with being a feminist.

If this isn't a tired old anti women trope, then it's lazy thinking.

There is zero doubt that misogyny is responsible for a lot of this.

Dear Lord. You only have to engage for five seconds on social media to be subjected to a landslide of it.

If you haven't been subjected to it, stop disbelieving women who have.

Ive seen men saying 'feminists created this it's their fault'. I don't think they know exactly what they mean. Probably just that it's followed on from the feminist separation of masculinity/femininity from the sexed body. But I haven't seen many (any?) men saying haha its great that female athletes have to compete against males. Might have missed it though.

But the vast vast majority of comments by men sey that it's not fair on women in sport and that is bad.

"On football, wasn't there a report that the Iran women's football team had many tw players?"

That was back in 2015, and one of their own officials reported it to the IFA.
There is a peculiar situation in Iran, where open homosexuality is not allowed, but men can transition (have full surgery) to transgender women and that is deemed OK.
The ones in the football team never had any surgery, although I don't think they played many or even any games.

I would say that most men are probably typical of my dh. He kept saying "nonsense" when I was telling him about this issue. He thought I was (and I must admit, I have a slight bit of form) exaggerating. When he saw for himself the issues he agreed it was utter madness - especially the case of the "girls" receiving scholarships in Connecticut being untransitioned males.

Perhaps the only conclusion is that women's sport will end and it will be "gender free" sport. Then we can go back to square one and start with a movement for a separate category for those under a certain weight, body mass and shoulder width...

John McEnroe was given a hard time when he said Serena would be beaten by around 700 male players, Matt Damon was ridiculed for joining in with MeToo. If a male sportsman comes forward, the tweeters will just hear them saying "I'm better than the women..." it's not a good medium for nuance.

I'm not saying this logic is correct, but I think this will be how many men see it.

As a bloke, and at the risk of "mansplaining", when I have read the DM comments on the Piers article or the Martina article, the vast majority of guys think this situation is very wrong.
Yes, you get the odd one or two making sneery comments. When I created a thread about McKinnon on a cycling forum in October last year, most of the older guys like myself and all but one of the women thought it was wrong, whilst it was the younger ones who were taking the transgender sympathy line.

And all of the nit-brained men who say ‘ha ha you wanted equality feminists now deal with it ha ha’ are too stupid to realise that ‘equal’ doesn’t always mean ‘the same’.

Women and men can be anti-feminist and have anti-women agendas.

I agree with that.

I still think making a sweeping statement like 'men don't generally give a shit about women' is ridiculous and anyone saying it needs to be called out for it.

There would be no issue with sexism and misogyny if the majority of men actually did properly care about women and consider them as valid and worthy as men like themselves.