Just thinking about one particular trans woman and wondered how common this is

[Arewehumanorbones]

So my relative came out as trans about 4 years ago.
As a non gender conforming feminist I was initially dismayed by the sexist stereotypes being embraced by my family member. Right down to breathy voice and sudden incompetence in things like opening jars.
Then we kind of accepted it and sort of moved on. But it all seemed like an act they were putting on, and it did occasionally slip and you'd see the old person again.
The personal profile is by now pretty familiar - middle aged, in IT, into gaming, anime, are gay/ or bisexual, ASD. They are also a keen live action role player who often played female roles.
And then I thought - maybe after all the gaming, LARPing, and various online anime stuff, maybe they just feel more comfortable when playing a role than when being themselves and "raw". Stereotypes help when playing a role..
All this "being my true self" just doesn't ring true to me when it involves so much medical cosmetic interventions. But playing a role to protect yourself in social situations - I totally get that! And if it can involve your porn life / fetish as well - well that's just brilliant!
So this is just my personal musings on one individual. Does anyone think this holds any merit?

I think so. Having an alter ego, or a new start as a new person, what's not to like?

Many people on the spectrum struggle with social communication and learning scripts to deal with this often forms part of therapy and support so I can definitely see the connection.

Ditto being more comfortable in an online space that allows you to develop a persona. Add to this maybe a black and white way of thinking and perhaps a desire to strictly categorise boy/girl things it's easy to see why your relative is susceptible to the idea that gender swapping answers a lot of issues they may feel they have.

My DS has ASD and whilst it's not something on his radar at all for now as far as I can tell I can see how it's something he would be susceptible to as a result of feeling like he doesn't quite fit in anywhere.

Obviously people with ASD vary as much as anyone else so I don't want to paint a broad brush over everyone but there is mounting evidence that children and young people especially are vulnerable to ROGD (rapid onset gender dysphoria) and probably some adults too.

Phew I thought I'd be dismissed out of hand!
It's been really hard this transition as a family. It's like a bereavement in that the person you knew is gone. Worse you are told it was always a lie - they never were really that old person, they've really always been this new person that they are being "true" to. But that's not how it appears to me. I'm close enough that I know when they are telling fibs...
Obviously everyone is different, whether trans, ASD or feminist, and we can't tar everyone with the same brush...

My friend and I were discussing this the other day about a TW we know who is a LARPer. It's like at some point the lines became blurred because they spent so much time pretending to be someone else.
Also fits the exact profile you describe. It's a bit chicken and egg. Are they drawn to that lifestyle because of any inclination or does that lifestyle cause it or even just act as a catalyst?

Chicken and egg... Hmm yes

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3513209-great-thread-by-fionne-mentioning-certain-charities

Been chatting about roles / characters on this thread too.

You might find the videos in this thread interesting OP. They are young women rather than men but the second video talks a lot about the role of social media, online spaces and personas contributing to their decision to identify as trans.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3507109-Pique-Resilience-Project-young-detransitioned-women-sharing-their-personal-stories

Thanks, I'll look into those tomorrow.
It's so hard to talk about this irl
You either get accused of being a horrible transphobic bigot (rather I am someone who was deeply worried a family member was making a irreversible mistake)
Or they have no idea what you are talking about.
I was tempted to join the trans widow thread, except as because I'm not the wife, it's not really my place....

This is interesting. I know a young man, quite a vulnerable nerdy young man if I'm honest, an IT person but not a good one, who has recently come out as trans... He is also a LARPer.

And if it can involve your porn life / fetish as well - well that's just brilliant!

No it isn't brilliant, it's grim as fuck. What he's doing is involving all his friends, family, colleagues, acquaintances and the general public in his AGP fetish whether they consent or not.

You don't have to be ok with this.

I don't know whether the transwidows thread is the right place as I'm not on there but they will certainly be able to give you a few pointers to recognising the gaslighty grooming bullshit.

I am diagnosed ASD and I also have dissociative identities (some of them are boys, I am female). I have early life trauma so lots of IDs to cope with trauma - a way that as a child I could disconnect from myself. I think that some autistic people maybe are traumatised by being autsitic in an insensitive world and so do create personas similar to how traumatised people do and maybe we're more likely to respond to trauma this way due to really highly sensitive sensory systems. It's quite hard as an autistic to be connected with your body especially if nobody ever accommodates your extra sensitivities. Creating a new identity which is not connected to the body like an opposite sex identity could be helping people to cope. For me, I have needed lots of therapy to be able to connect with my body and my experiences and to be true to what my body needs even when what I need might seem overly sensitive. My body needed deeply affirming as giving me wise information (even when what it told me was painful). It takes a real lot of work and dedication. I think though that recent trans activism (as opposed to old transsexualism) has been extremely entitled and encourages people to see their identities as more important than theirs or others' material reality. Of course lots of this entitlement is propped up by male privilege (though it's spreading to FtMs too). I give you an interesting example: most of my other identities are children, stuck at the age of a traumatising incident. However, I would certainly not seek admission to a primary school even when I am switched to those identities. Why? Because all the IDs I have know/ observe that my body is adult. It would be completely inappropriate for me to be in a primary school. Same goes for gender. My male IDs know they have a female body and wouldn't seek admission to a male survivors group, for example. It's odd because all my IDs absolutely believe themselves to be the age and gender they are, it feels ludicrous to me to think of them other than how they are (mostly young and some male). It is an emotional reality and has a lot of weight to it, because it helped me survive. And yet. I know what material reality is because I am female and I have experienced sexism and because I am working class and that sexism carried so much more weight as a result (i.e. a material loss for me means being on benefits rather than being propped up by wealthy parents whilst I recover from the sexist violence I've encountered). I can't deny material reality when sexual violence as a girl bears direct relation to my poverty and struggle with work as an adult. And I am politically materialist as a result of all this. So I would like if people would consider this element to the whole debate as it seems some here do. Slight digression to end: I know what gender dysphoria feels like and I had this feeling very badly as a late teen. However, some of the women in my life at that time asked me a question "what do you mean by a feeling like a boy? What is a boy?" and I tried to answer and realised that my answers felt anti-feminist and also related largely to being a lesbian and non-conforming and this inner "feeling" which could not be pinned down. I am thankful that those women asked that question because I was on the brink of transition more than once and it helped me to recognise that some of my thinking was flawed and possibly had internalised homophobia and misogyny at its heart, too (something that was understandable as a victim of both misogyny and homophobia as a child). I do think that this internalised stuff runs so so deep that it feels like a mysterious feeling rather than a trauma response to the gendered patriarchal world. Anyway, I've gone on a long time now. Thanks for your question, I think you are on to something. Many thanks for reading.

sudden incompetence in things like opening jars

I have a few recently transitioned TW friends who seem to revel in the apparent incompetence of women, to the point they feel we're bonded in our mutual inability to read maps or handle money - fucking insulting!!

I was tempted to join the trans widow thread, except as because I'm not the wife, it's not really my place....

There are lots of other contributions from non-trans widows on that thread. They might appreciate learning that awareness of the problem is growing beyond women who are partners of transwomen.

RedRosa that was fascinating. Thank you for taking the time to post all of that. You should write more on the subject, you write really well.

It does show what they think of women, doesn't it?

RedRosa90

I just wanted to say thank you for taking the time to explain your situation. I am so sorry for the difficult journey you are navigating. It's so clear that you are a wonderful person and I wish you all the best in all you do

Thank you TwitterlovesMAPs and MaryContrary :) it's an interesting topic to think about. I'm grateful for this space where it's possible to discuss things openly.

Longines

Funnily enough I am really good at four things in the world:-

1. Growing babies in my uterus
2. Breastfeeding
3. Reading maps
4. Handling money (well maths in general but I work in finance)

Interesting you mention the gaming/LARPing connection. This was covered in a podcast about gaming/storytelling lately:

rss.art19.com/episodes/a872ba96-00cc-45f9-a3fa-32e60bb897e4.mp3

redrosa
Thank you for sharing

This made me smile elsewhere tonight.

HRT magically makes those big strong hands go to mush.... help me.... help me

RedRosa90 - thank you for that insightful post.

RedRosa90 Thank you for sharing. Your words are incredibly moving and insightful

RedRosa I am sorry you've had to experience all those things. I appreciate you sharing them. It's added a few missing pieces of the jigsaw for me, at least for certain cases.

RedRosa that is a really interesting post, thank you for taking the time to post it. I am sorry that you have gone and are still going through all this.