Essex Library transgender upset.

[ChesterGreySideboard]

Essex County Council removes 'bigoted' transgender image www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-47064138

I agree that this isn’t an ideal picture at all, but in fairness I’m not sure what is.
My problem isn’t with people being upset about it but with this quote: Another said: "The depiction is not only awful but 'man, woman or transgender' is an extremely ignorant choice of genders."

Ffs.

But if you can read and understand that information/instruction, would your comprehension or reading ability be so poor that you needed a picture to understand the words 'man' and 'woman'?

My assumption, rightly or wrongly, is that these forms would be usually be filled out with assistance.

Sorry, missed the next page and R0wantrees reply.

Forms are often filled out with a supportive person present.

So why the need to word the questions so differently? The standard form asks for sex (m/f/other/prefer not to say), then in a separate question asks whether the person is trans (y/n/prefer not to say).

The easy-read version is impossible to understand, since it implies that a transgender person is neither male nor female.

So why the need to word the questions so differently? The standard form asks for sex (m/f/other/prefer not to say), then in a separate question asks whether the person is trans (y/n/prefer not to say).

The easy-read version is impossible to understand, since it implies that a transgender person is neither male nor female.

I expect that the good practice established over a long period of evidenced work is also under pressure from TRA lobbying, add in some well intentioned efforts to be both accessible and 'inclusive',
de-skill the people with actual knowledge of communication, add in some decisions by committee and a document intended to enable people with learning disabilities becomes less effective and a political football.

Of course whilst social media picks it apart, the people it was intended for are absent.

What would they do for non binary? Because if they'd only offered two "genders", you can be sure there would have been complaints about that.

When you can guess the content of all the deleted posts, have you been spending too long on this board?

You can also tell which moderators are on shift. During the night time TRAs run rampant on the board and that’s also the time GC messages get deleted.

What would they do for non binary?

Ignore it as being largely an affectation of undergraduates and gender studies academics people who've read too much rubbish and don't have enough real problems to deal with?

That's what you'd hope, really.

ROwan, that is so shocking. All of these trans activists and their allies seem to have a complete lack of empathy towards women.

"Natalie Bird, 38, a mother of two who fled an abusive former partner, was accused of “dangerous transphobia” by transgender activists in the party. She had said that opening up safe spaces without proper safeguards to anyone who said that they were female could put women at risk."
"Ms Bird was brought before a disciplinary hearing to face a complaint in the name of Zoe O’Connell, on behalf of the LGBT+ Liberal Democrats. The correspondence says that Ms Bird had “expressed troublesome views”.

Why does'nt someone from the Liberal party speak up against this treatment?

Ignore it as being largely an affectation of undergraduates and gender studies academics people who've read too much rubbish and don't have enough real problems to deal with?

It was what struck me about the Women's March London's social media nonsense about menstruating MPs and AFAB etc. rather than using the word woman.

They have no concept of accessibility.

eg adult literacy rates:
'More recently, in 2015, the OECD conducted its Survey of Adult Skills, known as PIAAC (Programme for the International Assessment of Adult Competencies). This survey found that 16.4% (or 1 in 6) of adults in England have literacy levels at or below Level 1, which is considered to be 'very poor literacy skills'.

The government’s 2011 Skills for Life survey defines literacy across five levels:

Entry Level 1 is equivalent to literacy levels at age 5-7.
Adults below Entry Level 1 may not be able to write short messages to family or read a road sign."

literacytrust.org.uk/parents-and-families/adult-literacy/what-do-adult-literacy-levels-mean/

It was what struck me about the Women's March London's social media nonsense about menstruating MPs and AFAB etc. rather than using the word woman.

Indeed. It was equally the hypocrisy that struck me, when they literally had no idea what the menstrual status of those women was. They were simply using it as a synonym for "woman" the avoidance of which was the whole point of using it as "inclusive" language in the first place.

But yes, using "menstruators" or "people with a cervix" creates barriers to access for important services for women with learning disabilities, female native speakers of other languages and women with a poor level of education.

Why does'nt someone from the Liberal party speak up against this treatment?

Andy The TRAs within LibDems are very powerful. They are determined to shut down any dissent or challenge and have been very effective so far in doing so. Sarah Brown and Zoe O'Connell have been engaged in Trans activism for many years.

See Jonny Best's article and his description of Sarah Brown and others' targetting of Bitch who was booked to perform at Queer Up North 2008:
medium.com/@JonnnyBest/the-story-of-my-first-brush-with-trans-activism-and-what-i-learned-3ef13e31fd37

Its going on in all parties though. People do speak up and perhaps in increasing numbers. There are powerful allies though:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3488261-The-Financial-Juggernaut-that-is-Stonewall

Slight tangent but why do they even care whether the respondent is:

Q30. What is your gender?
Male
Female
Prefer not to say
Prefer to use my own term

Q31. Does your gender identity match your sex as registered at birth?
Yes
No
Prefer not to say

It's a library consultation. Neither sex nor gender would seem essential to the results. If there were a compelling reason why then surely male, female, prefer not to say would have it covered. If some transpeople select their identified gender instead of their birth sex so what? It's not a medical trial. It's not a women's space issue.

But yes, using "menstruators" or "people with a cervix" creates barriers to access for important services for women with learning disabilities, female native speakers of other languages and women with a poor level of education.

Whereas boy, girl , man, woman, mum , dad are amongst the primary group of frequent and recognisable words.

Q31. Does your gender identity match your sex as registered at birth?

This is not accessible language.
Its not good practice for a public service questionaire.

(I wonder in the Campaign for Plain English is still going?)

R0wantrees yes, but also irrelevant to the topic. Why on earth would the council want to gather such personal information as part of this consultation?

I suspect the original form has male/female kind of by default. A woke person got all excited about introducing wokeness to the form, went overboard. Failed to then think GDPR do I need this data?

YY Towel most forms and consultations are constantly recycled and modified slightly and repeat repeat.

That phrasing is widepread now though
A friend of mine had it for one of her toddler's groups recently.

People creating it most likely think its 'best practice' or are not a position to challenge it.
Most people reading it (if they can understand it) think its PC nonsense.

It's simple, only two questions are needed. One asking what sex they are (easy pictures), and then an essay of not more than 15k words on their thoughts and feelings, which the respondent can illustrate themselves.

The sad irony is that people who have low levels of literacy or learning disabilities are one of the groups most likely to benefit from a well-supported library service.

Does your gender identity match your sex as registered at birth?

This is a ridiculous question. How can anyone answer it?
Surely most people would feel compelled to say: Uh, how do you mean?

Ok, it's a shit picture, but I would like to see one of the frothers show what image would be acceptable, I suspect there are slim pickings.

Also, Zoe O'Connell stating Essex County Council isn't 'safe' - drama llama much? Get over yourself mate. The picture isn't endangering lives ffs.

I'm offended by the picture of the woman. I feel she doesn't really represent me.

The sad irony is that people who have low levels of literacy or learning disabilities are one of the groups most likely to benefit from a well-supported library service.

Absolutely & people on low income, homeless, refugees etc have higher levels of low literacy skills.

Also, Zoe O'Connell stating Essex County Council isn't 'safe' - drama llama much? Get over yourself mate. The picture isn't endangering lives ffs.

Zoe O'Connell lives in Cambridge and in the 2013 interview with the Guardian described:
"a computer network manager who is also in the Territorial Army. "

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/apr/20/greatest-sexual-taboo-polyamorous-transgender

Surely we'd get away from most of this outrage and inadvertent offence causing by just not asking anyone what their sex/gender is. For 99% of stuff it simply isn't relevant and shouldn't be recorded.