Queueing for toilets

[ExitThisWay]

So I know a lot has been written here about women’s toilets - but I’ve been thinking specifically about when females have to queue for a significantly longer time than males to use a toilet provision.

This happens to me frequently. At days out. Shopping centres. Museums, theatres / venues. Even showering my kids after swimming lessons. It Seems the norm is women queue, men don’t. Although I’m unable to go into the men’s whilst I’m queueing to see if similar is happening there, I don’t see people queuing up out the doors etc. Im also fed up of it being so busy in cramped toilets that with our buggies and bags and coats - we end up jostling for space. Having to squeeze past people to use hand driers etc.

So I’ve started writing / emailing everytime it happens. Just pointing out to organisations and service providers, that is indirect sex discrimination, and asking the service provider what action they will take to rectify it - as, you know, sex discrimination ( direct or indirect ) is illegal.

& I Just wanted to share as it not a really really difficult thing to do. Quick email and that’s it. Maybe reply back when they say ‘sorry we were busy at that time’ ( which one place did and I replied - being busy doesn’t let you act against the law)

Anyway. I thought if a few people ( or loads of people) did this, then maybe things would change. Providers would take notice.

And I know this isn’t a huge issue.
But the little things stack up.
My kids are little. And everytime they are queueing, and see the males fly in and out. It says something to them. That it’s ok to waste our time and not men’s . It’s ok for Male to be default. And that we must queue up, and be reminded of our place. Every single time.

If you manage one e mail / letter / phone call/ ask to see the manager about this. Then thanks. I appreciate it.

Hear hear op! Totally agree with you!

Perhaps target public planning/architecture students too?

The overall lack of public lavs is an issue too.

It's one of those 'equal isn't fair' issues. Same number of toilets so that's equal. But it's not, is it?

This bothers me very much. Recently, I actually decided not to go to an event because I knew I’d end up queuing for the women’s loos if I went, and it put me off. Such a small thing but it really does have an impact on enjoyment. Especially when it rarely happens to men.

It absolutely is discrimination!

Even worse waiting for the disabled access loo...

This always ends up with some bright spark proposing all mixed loos.

i went to an event (outside the uk) they had 1 porta cabin, (so bank of loos) for men and 4 porta cabins worth for woman maybe 6 loos a cabin!! I wanted to take a photo it was so great! There was I porta cabin for family , disabled. That was just oneside of the event there was the same the other. The interval was 20mins so enough time to pop to the loo and then get some food and coffee. There was loads of kiosks for food and stuff. They must have made a fortune on food and drinks as there was enough time to go get them and i didn t have to really worry about myself and the kids needing to go widdle! I went to another out door event and they had mens men/woman and women. The ratio was fantastic 10 womans loos to 5 mens and 5 men/woman. Interesting the womans loos were still clean by the end of the day and my daughter refused to go in the men/womans as there was wee all over the floor and it was getting pretty stinky. Again not in the uk... ALSO in the family restaurant they had womans loo and men/woman. So a womans space and then unisex which makes sense practically.

I have said for years that women need to have twice as many toilets as men in Theatres etc. that is why you book an aisle seat and are on the sprinter's blocks immediately the lights go up.
Anyone remember when it was literally a penny to get into the women's toilets. In that time men did not have to pay anything. I know they do now in public areas such as bus and train stations.
As one gets older the need to use a toilet fairly quickly increases.

Thanks - am heartened other people agree. And yes - will no doubt have the ‘unisex is the solution’ opinions. But that’s not good enough. We need our female toilets. And if we are queueing longer than men, we need more of them.

I used to frequent Fabric decades ago that had unisex loos. Utterly rank. People having sex, pee everywhere, just gross.

What bothers me more is how insanely long it takes women to use the bloody bathroom!

Maybe if you didn’t take 15 minutes to have a pee we wouldn’t have such a long queue!
I don’t know what you’re doing in there but SERIOUSLY lock door- jeans down- pee- wipe- jeans up- out!

It’s not a 15 minute event!!!

With kids or if you’re unwell/disabled fine! But next time you’re queuing, pay attention to how long it takes women to do their business- then ask why our queues are longer!

Great idea, OP.

Sometimes it needs a thread like this to remind me that

• I, and every female, have had to put up with this situation all our lives
• I've felt that there is nothing I can do about it and no-one cares anyway
• I've never felt confident when explaining why I, and other women, require immediate and urgent access to a cubicle - stress incontinence, periods, miscarriages and so on and so on. But actually, the OP has reminded me that women, as a class, are being treated differently and unfairly in being made to like it or lump it.

When I see someone like the OP challenging the status quo with a straightforward and do-able idea, it gives me the courage to do likewise. Here, OP, have a

Good idea OP.

Every time I use public loo I queue and watch the men walk in and out of the gents while doing so.

I will start to write letter thank you.

When I've discussed this online men seem to get very angry I've raised it. All suggest mixed sex toilets are the solution. I think their hard drives probably need a check.

Thanks! Long time mostly lurking on this board has enabled me to see some things really clearly. And this one just seems such an easy one to start to make an impact. No big complex theoretical debates. No weighing up different peoples rights. A nice simple one that’s easy to get involved and make a difference with.

Maybe if you didn’t take 15 minutes to have a pee we wouldn’t have such a long queue!
I don’t know what you’re doing in there but SERIOUSLY lock door- jeans down- pee- wipe- jeans up- out!

Do you realise how many women have issues with using the loo once they’ve had children? Many of those issues go permanently unresolved.
It takes me 5 mins to urinate, longer if I need to change my tampon/deal with a mooncup. This isn’t an unusual thing, particularly for women a lot older than me as their generation just sucked up their birth injuries.
I see women at work (when not on mat leave) who take 10+ min to provide a urine sample, on a daily basis.

And OP I will do the same as you. Thank you.

I just don't get why this is still a 'thing'. At an open air event recently, women were queuing outside in the rain while the men laughed at us!

Every public venue is the same. We need to sit, men don't - we need more cubicles. We are usually the ones carrying babies (inside us + outside); shopping; pushchairs etc.

It's just so f'ing obvious! I'm with you OP + will start emailing too!

...and when you're on your period...dont get me started!

MrDarcywillbemine I can give you many reasons why some women need a long time in the lavs ...

• cleaning up menstrual flooding
• dealing with post birth incontinence issues
• having hormone related IBS

... being just three !

You may not suffer from any of these conditions, but surely you can put yourself in the position of other women who may?

@sanjelli

I did say if there are ‘reasons’ then fine

🤔 my uni friends snapchat each other from the loos - which they use as paid breaks from their shop jobs! Literally just go to the loos to kill time! (At our big local shopping centre)

• you’re not telling me that EVERYONE requires longer - i’d Guess 50% of those in the queue play on their phones in there!

Well OP, you’ve clearly never been to a David Gilmour gig at the Royal Albert Hall, and skipped gaily past the snaking queues of paunchy, midlife crisis, beer swilling men, desperate for a pee in the, vastly over subscribed, men’s loos whilst you enter the fragrant haven of the barely used ‘ladies’ to leisurely go about your business in peace and solitude. I really enjoyed that night . Of course, if you’re not referring to a David Gilmour gig, then I’m totally with you

MrDarcey - we absolutely take longer to use a toilet. This is due to our biological differences. And also social / cultural reasons- like being much more likely to have small children with us etc.

Whatever your opinions on this are totally fine with me I’m not going to argue. But as someone who is trying to do a small thing to stop unlawful indirect discrimination against women- kindly don’t derail this thread.

If you want to support my endeavours, I encourage you. A quick e mail or letter everytime you see a queue for the ladies toilets and not the men’s would really help. If you don’t then that’s cool too.

And thanks you to everyone who sends an e mail or letter next time it happens. I honestly believe it will make a difference, somewhere, somehow.

MrDarcy, can I conclude from your wonderful description of us as being time wasters that you are a man? You do realise that most women don’t think its fun to chill in the loo, especially if they’re packed. A lot of women have ‘reasons’ and they are none of your business

Great idea to bring the matter to someone's attention every time there is a discrepancy in the provision of facilities.

But treating the sexes differently doesn't automatically make it unlawful... Just be careful not to go down that route and undermine the very good point being made

I'm a quick wee-er - grew up in a big family with one toilet. Still, when out and about it can take longer - not least if it's one of those cubicles where it's not really wide enough so everything I do I whack some part of me on the toilet roll dispenser or the sanitary bin.

It's not rocket science here - building designers know all this stuff, they have access to all the stats. Why on earth is it still happeniing.

There was a thread about toilet provision a while back that made the very interesting point that because you can fit more urinals than cubicles, there is provision for more people the use the facilities simultaneously in the gents than the ladies.

If you've got time to watch the video it is enlightening and something I discussed with my teenage ds last time we were out and had to use public toilets. Never even crossed my mind before, I thought it was all to do with having to sit taking longer!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3427591-WPUK-Bath-fascinating-important-speech-by-Clara-Greed-Professor-of-Inclusive-Urban-Planning-specialist-in-toilet-provision-with-particular-emphasis-upon-womens-needs