Autism and trans

[Randomusername01]

As an autistic person and parent of autistic child, was horrified to read this article, and in particular this line One practical outcome of this research is that clinicians are recommending that autistic youth should be screened for gender dysphoria. Wtf. No no no.

Agree with everyone else that it should be the reverse.

I'm might be talking utter bollocks here, I often do so forgive me if I do. I'm autistic, I find it really difficult to relate to neurotypical women (please don't be offended, I just don't know how to talk to them). My female friends are 90% autistic. I find it so much easier talking to men, I think it's because the men I know use speech as a means to an end rather than make small talk and I'm shit at small talk (I'm really not trying to be sexist here I promise). That coupled with a disinterest in make up and traditionally 'girlie' things I worry that if I was a teenager now people might query gender dysphoria in me, it makes me worry for DD in a few years as an autistic girl.

I'm a woman and proud of it and wouldn't be any other way. I also worry about the stats saying autistics are more likely to be gender dysophoric - are they or are they trying to match themselves to an unrealistic gender stereotype?

Gender dysphoria in the sense of hating the gender assigned to them on basis of their biological sex? I am sure a lot of autistic women have that.

I am not so sure that they actually feel dysphoric about their actual bodies.

Pass. All I know is that I'm a woman and I don't comply with what some I society think that means. I don't actually care what those who think that way feel about that I'm secure in who I am. But if this was happening now I think I could have been manipulated and so could DD. And that scares me.

Does that make more sense?

I have a theory based on first hand experience.....

The issue isn't that people who have ASD have gender dysphoria but that people DIAGNOSED with ASD are found to have gender dysphoria. Historically ASD is overdiagnosed and until recently GD was relatively rare.

If you think about a young boy struggling to identify with other boys, failing to relate, refusing to get involved in do called gender appropriate activities then the child is labelled ASD.
Further down the line when gender identity issues come to the fore a diagnosis of GD is made.

So..... does the person have ASD or was it an interim go to diagnosis before diagnosing GD? Address GD and the ASD improves...but that assumes ASD was valid in the first place.

Im not saying they cant coexist but simple the issues associated with GD in children are very very similar to GD....

refusing to get involved in do called gender appropriate activities

This isn't how ASD is diagnosed....

m not saying they cant coexist but simple the issues associated with GD in children are very very similar to GD....

They are not though are they?

*refusing to get involved in do called gender appropriate activities

This isn't how ASD is diagnosed....*

In some places it is. Is shouldn't be but it is.

In some places it is. Is shouldn't be but it is.

No it really isn't.

Autism is debilitating impairment in three triads.

Social interaction
Communication and Language
Imagination / routine deviation.

none of this is based on weather they play with blue or pink toys, or play with Milly or Tommy in the play ground, or play football or pinkfootball, but impairments in the ability to play.

historically ASD is overdiagnosed

It really isn't! And it's only recently that people are starting to become aware of its prevalence in girls.

Yep, my actual real life interaction skills are dire, forums are easier. I have deficits in all areas of the triad.

I just don't fit with any kind of 'girlie' expectations and neither do my female autistic friends. But it's not diagnostic criteria.

ASD is underdiagnosed in girls. And if all it took was to lack an interest in ‘gender appropriate’ activities that would have spared me a year waiting for an assessment that then took me three months to complete.

Although it’s not part of the classic ‘triad’ a lot of us have sensory processing issues too.

They’re much more of an issue with me than language (at least the written word).

I'm much better with writing than face to face interaction.

I saw an article once that said the internet is like Braille for Aspies. I probably type more words per day than I speak.

It sounds to me like Autistic kids just aren't socialised into 'gender boxes' from a young age like the majority are, but that should be a good thing actually. The theory of mind that says x is for boys/y is for girls, certain behaviour is 'inappropriate' for boys but not girls (eg crying). Things picked up from observation and social consequence that goes over their heads like so much.

Over diagnosed? I don’t think you found agreement for that in all the desperate parents and carers struggling with school refusing anxious children. Criticised for attendance receiving no help and being sent on parenting classes. Having to become advocates and experts in the system to get their children the help they need against all the odds.

Of course it's under diagnosed. How else did I go without a diagnosis for 38 years?
Aspie I'm the same, type more than I speak. Online forums have massively widened my world.

the internet is like Braille for Aspies

I so like this.

I probably type more words per day than I speak.

It's rather a relief to see this written down. I am honestly wondering about trying to join a choir simply to get exercise for my vocal mechanism. But without needing to do small talk.

A very interesting thread.

Wtf? I can't find the words to articulate how horrified I am by the idea of screening autistic kids for GD.

And echoing all the others - not doing 'gender appropriate' activities (whatever the fuck they are) is not part of an ASD diagnosis. And ASD is not overdiagnosed.

I noticed the article gave the following reason (which I've seen before) for those on the autistic spectrum being over represented but I don't think the author has thought that through.

"On the other hand, it’s possible that autism is overrepresented among trans youth because autistic people are less concerned with social norms and less likely to bow to social pressures that keep other trans people from coming out."

The prevalence of ASDs in children is about 1.7%. Half of those will be classed as also having a learning disability ie IQ under 70 and I assume we are not trans-ing those kids. Therefore a subgroup of just 0.85% of all children are accounting for 30% of Tavistock referrals.

So 750 referrals a year (2500 * 30% = 750)

The article suggests that ASD kids are not over represented but non autistic children are under represented due to 'being concerned about social norms'. So when those non autistic kids stop being shamed into repressing their gender identity and come out in equivalent numbers we will see an even distribution that reflects the whole population.

Meaning over 88000 kids will be referred to the Tavistock each year!

(750/0.85% = 88235)

It really worries me the number of autistic kids and adults who believe they are in the wrong body. I agree that kids with gender dysphoria should be assessed for ASD.

My own theory is that, in the main, gender roles aren’t explicitly spelt out. Sure, there’s some ‘boys do this, girls do that’, but gender norms are generally more subtly enforced: an approving nod here, a smile there for ‘appropriate’ behaviour, a disapproving look or a frown for ‘inappropriate’ behaviour. And other non-verbal signals too, such as who to include in your games and who to exclude.

And autistic kids are poor at picking up those non-verbal signals. Those subtle messages about how we ‘should’ behave sail over our heads.

And the result is that we end up gender non-conforming because that socialisation failed.

Then along come the TRAs and tell us explicitly that this is how girls should act, and this is how boys should act, and we see we don’t fit that ‘normal’ gender role, and we begin to doubt our own gender.