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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Don't tell me to LTB-I thought I had peak transed him, but no.

36 replies

GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 10:52

Anyone got an idea how I can confront this issue with my husband? He is a bastion of male white privilege, but gets upset if I mention it.

He was on the transvestites are my friends thing. He works in the arts and has done for years, so most people aren't very conforming.

He and I have had to agree to disagree on many things but he was slowly climbing the hill. He agrees that he wouldn't want a penis in the changing room or toilet with his mum or daughter.

Both his brother and I are staunch lefties. I was talking to him about the fact I had cut my Labour card up because of the Labour's treatment of women. He hadn't heard of Lily Madigan but said it was fine for a Trans person to be a Women's Officer, and then asked if she had already had the op?

DH has asked me not to talk to his brother about this issue anymore as its very sensitive. DBIL has a male friend who wants to come out as trans but has a wife and children.

Now I am not happy about being told what I can and can't talk about but have agreed that I will just keep the peace.

I said that it was probably awful for the mans wife and that how can he think he is a woman unless he believes in souls? DH is not religious and is very wary of religion. DH said that the man can't help his compulsion and how he feels being trans is just like how a gay person or a paedophile feels-it's a compulsion they can't help

At this point I told him we shouldn't talk anymore and we are both working from home in separate rooms.

I am upset and gobsmaked and don't know what to think anymore. I am not articulate or intelligent enough to have the argument with him but I need to. Any basic pointers would be appreciated.

OP posts:
Grauniad · 27/11/2018 10:58

I think you may BOTH be right.

I've seen trans feelings described (maybe on here?) as being like an overwhelming itch that you cannot scratch, so 'a compulsion that you can't help' may be pretty accurate.

An unbearable compulsion is not the same thing as being a woman, and is likely to be very difficult for the partner to live with as well as the person concerned, so you're right too.

(OCD is part of our lives here. I have sympathy. I also try to keep a grasp on reality.)

Grauniad · 27/11/2018 10:59

That probably didn't make sense - I know you weren't discussing OCD, but both obsession and compulsion seemed relevant here.

Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 11:00

Thank you Grauniad. That is a very sensible and measured way of looking at things.

OP posts:
Badstyley · 27/11/2018 11:01

Oh, so if his proclivities leant towards paedophilia you shouldn’t discuss it either, because he can’t help it. Alright then...

Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 11:03

Probably not at Sunday lunch Bad, but yes, I am of course with you.

OP posts:
Badstyley · 27/11/2018 11:04

My post was in relation to your DH’s comments btw, not a specific person. Just clarifying that.

Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 11:08

I know Bad.

OP posts:
TinyRick · 27/11/2018 11:30

Setting aside the fact he's a paedophile apologist...

You should ask if it's okay for a Women's Officer (trans or not) to block thousands of women?

Where does he stand on the sports issue?

Calvinsmam · 27/11/2018 11:34

Ewww he thinks that peadophilia is a compulsion that cant be helped?
Same as being gay? Confused

That’s some wokey dude bro penis entitlement right there.

ErrolTheDragon · 27/11/2018 11:36

how he feels being trans is just like how a gay person or a paedophile feels-it's a compulsion they can't help

Wow. Debating trans issues is one thing but making a parallel between gay people and paedophiles is appalling. Making that parallel between trans people en masse and paedophiles is appalling.

UpstartCrow · 27/11/2018 11:40

Setting aside the fact he's a paedophile apologist...
He is siding with the rights of hypothetical men against those of his life partner and daughter.

You can't convert him. When they go quiet its not because they agree with you, or are thinking really hard about what you said, its that they don't want to discuss it any more.

Badstyley · 27/11/2018 11:51

Oh yeah, being homosexual as a compulsion, erm... no. I like having sex with women but I’m not compelled to do so. Being able to help myself suggests there’s a reason why I should.

ErrolTheDragon · 27/11/2018 11:53

Setting aside the fact he's a paedophile apologist...

No, don't. He's exposed himself as a virtue-signaller suffering from a massive dose of moral licensing. He thinks of himself as a good guy, and this licenses him to be the exact reverse. He needs to take a long hard look at himself.

I've mentioned 'moral licensing' elsewhere - if you've got a 'good person' behaving badly (whether it be leftie dudes, religious, antivivisectionists, whatever) it's worth thinking about, explains a lot.

Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 11:53

Setting aside the fact he's a paedophile apologist

How do I set that aside? Why would I want to?

OP posts:
Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 11:57

He doesn't care about sports.

I am hoping that he opened his mouth before he engaged brain, but even that is a worry because why have that IN your brain.

OP posts:
FaithFrank · 27/11/2018 11:59

His defence of paedophiles is what's really shocking. That and the homophobia and transphobia necessary to equate gay people and trans people with paedophiles.

Original poster
GoldenPomBearBadge · 27/11/2018 12:01

I know faith, I know, that's what I am doing here.

We did have a "short discussion" before I asked him to stop talking to me. I said even if you believe that paedophiles can't help their feelings then you must believe they can help their actions. And he gave me that...

OP posts:
UpstartCrow · 27/11/2018 12:06

Look, you can't fix him. There are no words or arguments that will make him see things from your POV.
You need to reach that point and accept it. He doesn't agree with you. He doesn't care about your rights or those of his daughters.

Let it go and decide what you want to do from here on.

TimeLady · 27/11/2018 12:09

I'd point DBIL to the Transwidows thread here on MN and let him make his own mind up.

TinyRick · 27/11/2018 12:09

Sorry, I meant that I was setting that fact aside as I just found it too shocking to comment properly on it.

So went with 'easier' questions.

Calvinsmam · 27/11/2018 12:11

I’ve had the horrible realisation recently how much society puts men’s right to orgasm how they wish above absolutely everything else.
Men genuinely believe they are entitled to it. That it’s their right and everyone else’s rights stop at that line.

LikeDust · 27/11/2018 12:14

I would find the sympathy with paedophiles very worrying.
People having the urge to perpetrate abuse being described as an 'itch'.? Shock
Has he been reading anything dodgy or hanging around with anyone dodgy? It's not normal to come out with that. Imagine if he had replaced the word 'paedophile' with 'rapist' how would that go down? Is the urge to rape an 'itch'? How about sadism? Is the urge to hurt and humiliate an itch?

NotZenEnough · 27/11/2018 12:20

There is a good podcast on feminist current about a wife coping with her husband becoming transgender.
Maybe in cases of severe dysphoria a person may feel a compulsion to become the opposite sex, but surely this is a psychological disorder and needs to be treated accordingly. If after time and significant therapy the person still feels the need to transition, then they have my sympathy. Not necessarily my support and I would not remain in a relationship on this basis. A massive problem for people suffering from gender dysphoria is that there is so much information available which tells them that the cure is transitioning.

Your husband's concession to the paedophilia argument is pretty much in line with what Doc Amitay and Ray Blanchard were saying on a YouTube talk.

Don't tell me to LTB-I thought I had peak transed him, but no.
Threewheeler1 · 27/11/2018 12:23

He's exposed himself as a virtue-signaller suffering from a massive dose of moral licensing. He thinks of himself as a good guy, and this licenses him to be the exact reverse. He needs to take a long hard look at himself.
Spot on Erroll.

Do you think he'll actually listen Golden, even to your logical viewpoint?
I think sometimes people are so attached to the idea of their being a 'progressive', as though it indicates a higher form of intelligence, empathy, understanding etc, that anything which takes a more grounded view gets rejected out of hand.

I suppose it depends on whether he believes in basic biology and women's rights and if he has the ability to empathise with your position as a woman.

NotZenEnough · 27/11/2018 12:31

Just clarifying in case I sounded like an apologist, which I am not!!! doc Amitay and Ray Blanchard claim that paedophiles can not help their feelings but absolutely do have control over their actions.
It's a hard one to hear, and is horrible to think about. I have no idea what I think about it, apart from agreeing that yes, people can control their actions. The idea that there are people with these tendencies is disgusting and frightening. Your husband made his point a very strange way in conflating homosexuality (does no harm) to transgenderism (can do significant harm) and paedophilia (catastrophic levels of harm caused by this)