Liberal feminist?

[Crookedcolours]

Hi everyone

Long time lurker on mn but very vocal with friends and family re feminism and do what I can with regards to petitions, emails, complaints, surveys that kind of thing.

So go back quite a few years in sociology we were told radical feminists believed the only way to achieve true equality was to reform the entire structure of power, government, laws etc. And that was the difference between radical and liberal.

Because of this reason I've always 'identified' as a liberal feminist believing it can be done within the current framework.

But I've noticed over the years scarcely anyone describing themselves as a liberal feminist. And within feminist forums liberal feminists seem to be looked down upon or a dirty word, whereas on social media as we know radical feminists is a term that's practically been vilified.

This second point annoys me because as I like to point out, the definition is relatively simple and there's nothing crazy about it like you'd assume from the hatred.

I want to know your thoughts on this.

Do you 'identify' as radical or liberal?
What are your views on liberal feminists and is my definition correct?

I was always broadly speaking a feminist. I didn’t find out what radfem and libfem meant till a few years ago and immediately recognised that I come down firmly on the radfem side. I don’t see the benefit in seeking to shoehorn women into systems created by men, and for the benefit of men. Women will always be at a disadvantage in those systems, and simply compensating women for that disadvantage does not achieve anything. That’s not to say that libfems don’t do good important work of course, and as PP have said there is a massive overlap, so I think both strands have good and valid points, and indeed a lot to offer. Also like every other group in society, feminists are not a homogenous group and we won’t agree about everything, so while I might disagree re pragmatism vs complete restructural aims, and in all honesty accept that liberal feminism might benefit more people in the short to medium term, I’m an idealist who does what I can, so I class myself, if I must, as a radfem.

As for the new form of porn and kink positive, pro sex work feminism, which is not feminist at all imo, well, I have no time for any of that. It’s just male appeasement imo, so just handmaidenry as far as I’m concerned.

There is no single Libfem view on prostitution or trans.

Equally there's no single radfem view on these issues either.

Even during the Speaker Corner incident, I think it was actually one of the women on the other side who stepped in to stop the TRA attack.

She tried, but on of the TRAs she was supporting turned on her and was really menacing.

Interesting discussion. Has given me a lot to think about so thank you. Still trying to learn and figure it all out.