Scotland's Children's Commissioner - 12 years should be allowed to change legal sex without parental permission

[howonearthdidwegethere]

Had anyone else picked this up?

Scotland's Children's Commissioner submitted a response to the Scottish Government's consultation on reform of the GRA.

He believes that children aged 12 should be able to change their legal sex even without their parent's consent.

www.cypcs.org.uk/ufiles/Gender-Recognition-Consultation.pdf

A child aged 12 might be in the last year of primary school and he thinks they should be able to change their birth certificate without asking the parents.

He also believes the minimum age of criminal responsibility should be at least 14, if not older.

www.scotsman.com/news/plea-to-further-increase-age-of-criminal-responsibility-1-4830605

So if a child aged 12 is sufficiently mature to change their legal sex without any reference to their parents, why not lower the age of consent? Is that where we are heading?

Jeezo - this is ludicrous. Why not let a 12yr old get a tattoo?

So if a child aged 12 is sufficiently mature to change their legal sex without any reference to their parents, why not lower the age of consent? Is that where we are heading?

I used to think it was paranoia, but now I think yes, this is the motivation behind a a lot of the push.

This is him: twitter.com/Bruce_Adamson

Check out his bio: "promoting and safeguarding children's rights"

So, Bruce, what happens when a child aged 12 wants to change their legal sex and their parents (quite reasonably) object? Should they be removed to local authority care?

Seeking to drive a wedge between a vulnerable child and their parents is not a good look for a Children's Commissioner, is it?

Really shocking

I would like to see another legal opinion as he says also that children can instruct a solicitor and consent to medical treatment from age 12. But I cant believe that a child of this age would always have free rein and there would be no constraints or protocols. Or that parents could have no influence.

When you tie this up with the Named Person fiasco this is seriously scary.

@HamiltonCork

That's exactly what Edinburgh Council suggested in their response (I remember James Kirkup tweeting about it at the time and just tracked it down).

www.edinburgh.gov.uk/download/meetings/id/56251/item_86_-scottish_government_consultation%E2%80%93_review_of_gender_recognition_act_2014

Bloody hell.

Our public institutions are falling over themselves to remove safeguards for our kids and seeking to drive a wedge between them and their parents at a time when they are very vulnerable.

I'm going to raise this with my MSP when I see them. A friend says she has already done so with a few of her list MSPs and they all nearly fell off their seats when she mentioned the Commissioner's position.

I just feel so despondent. I live in a SNP stronghold and none of them will go against the party line (don’t get me started on how undemocractic this is).

Yep, that's exactly where it's heading. I've spent years and years wondering how they'd manage to do it, and here we are. I take no pleasure in finally having the answer though. My next question is, how do we prevent the final piece of the jigsaw being put into place?

Mermaids and other charities/ lobby groups have been pushing towards a similar policy in the GRA consultation.

Ireland may also be adopting likewise.

I mean, how is this different to Tatchell's position:

twitter.com/SophiaSmith222/status/1060941191515176961

"In a fully democratic and egalitarian society, there can be no question of adults usurping the rights of young people by resort to arbitrary and autocratic laws which deny them responsibility for decisions affecting their lives."

Dress it up as liberation. How clever.

THEY ARE CHILDREN FGS

HamiltonCork Have you met any of your SNP MSPs? Quite a few of them do have concerns and a face-to-face conversation is usually better.

@howonearthdidwegethere can I ask where you got the doc & whether the CRIA (impact assessment) was linked to your source? I'd like to see that if you have a link? Thanks.

I agree with Betsymoo . Many MSPs have concerns and are beginning to talk about it albeit not as publicly as I would like! That's why we need to get out there , meet them in person and have the conversation. Courage calls!

I wrote.

SNP are the borg and will not break the party line, Scotland blazing ahead with total inclusion eg total removal of all safeguarding and if you don't like that then transphobia is a hate crime you bigot.

Labour lalala nothing bad happening here and aren't we all wonderful for being so right on, are you not right on do you need educating?

Green nothing bad happening here just doing the same as the rest of the world and anyone not on board is a bigoted dinosaur.

Tory not happy and have concerns but sure as shit won't say it publicly.

We're fucking doomed. All these people who should know better. These people whose job is to serve the general public not serve up children on platters to the devious few.

As I read on here somewhere the other day, if you are still not gender critical and against self id then you just haven't thought hard enough about it yet and followed the law change to it's logical conclusion. Really there is no fence to sit on here and get arse splintered there is only the protection of women and children being systematically dismantled by the government.

The problem with a borg party in power is that nothing will ever be debated. I see nothing democratic in that approach. I have no one to vote for.

Think harder Scotland, apply logic for pity's sake.

@VerifyToTerrify

Sorry, only just spotted your question.

Which document do you mean? I found both links via a Google search.

What's a CRIA?

It is not about usurping Young People’s rights - the UN convention of the Rights of the Child article 12 provides for a child’s voice to be heard (I am referring to the quote which howonearth posted) It is about safe guarding.

Article 18 states that it is the parents’ responsibility to bring up the child and the State should support parents by giving them the support and assistance they need.

Article 19 provides for children to be free from harm and 20 for when a child cannot live with their family.

I would be very surprised if the writers of the convention which has 140 signatory countries intended harm to be not allowed to change legal sex, and that the State should in this case breach article 18.

Yes, that’s where it’s going. You can consent to life altering treatment and sterilisation so you can consent to anything else.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/19/gender-recognition-act-reforms-six-legal-views-transgender-debate

Peter dunne is a member of TELI - the group set up to push trans related legal challenges. Here he argues for lowering the age of consent for transing children. parliament should also make appropriate provision for younger transgender individuals for whom access to gender recognition, through parental consent or Gillick competence would best promote their welfare.

This NOT what Gillick competence was intended for.

It amazes me that an educated law lecturer cannot understand that this opens the door for lowering the age of sexual consent.

The SNP are on a roll. Named persons was all about getting those pesky parents out of the way so the nationalist grooming programme can be implemented and no family is in a legal position to complain about unmet needs any longer. Only the EU over ruled that farcical legislation. This is a logical short cut to a similar outcome - children distanced and removed from parental protection and instead guided and influenced by those who have no relationship or vested interest in the child's wellbeing. This is deeply disturbing stuff and obviously the creation of a paedophile friendly system.

There seems to be some very extreme genderist politics coming out of Scotland. What is going on up there?!

@howonearthdidwegethere the last page of that document stated they attached comments on the CRIA - Children's Rights Impact Assessment.

I've not come across any impact assessments & it's not very clear whether the CRIA referenced is one completed by CYPCS or they are simply commenting on one completed by someone else.

I'll google to see if I can find anything.

Thanks

www.stonewallscotland.org.uk/our-work/blog/historic-announcement-lgbt-inclusive-education-scotland

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3377446-Tell-me-about-LGBT-Youth-Scotland

fairplayforwomen.com/scottish_stole_woman/

fairplayforwomen.com/scot_results/