'I'm not meant to be a bloke': Woman who changed gender to become man called Lee says sex swap was a huge mistake

[TrashyTerf]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6351711/Hemel-Hempstead-transgender-man-60-regrets-gender-reassignment-surgery-11-years-on.html

Warning: DM link! (Although I'd rather click on a DM link than a Guardian link these days!)

Trigger warning: child abuse details included below

*"A transgender man who had a sex change 15 years ago has branded it the biggest mistake of his life and wishes he was still a woman.

Lee Harries, 60, of Hemel Hempstead, Hertfordshire, was born Debbie Karemer but underwent gender reassignment surgery at the age of 44.

After years of struggling with his sexual identity, he had his breasts, uterus, ovaries and fallopian tubes removed, before doctors made a prosthetic penis for him.

But years later he says: 'I'm not meant to be a bloke' and believes he is not transgender.

Mr Harries, who married his partner Alan before he transitioned, has undergone counselling, where experts have told him he has PTSD as a result of being sexually assaulted by his father."*

Datun I think that the 'memorandum of understanding' prevents much discussion about what might else be going on for the person who presents with gender identity issues.

This is so very tragic.

Many of the comments make the connection with the increased transing of children.

Although it will be little help to her, at least stories like this are helping people wake up to the ridiculous affirm-only policies and the harm being done to children.

from Guardian article about schools' approach:

"Davies-Arai says her broader concern is that by affirming students’ gender identity, schools may be nudging them down a route that can lead to cross-sex hormones and life-changing surgery without enough time to reflect. Teachers, she says, “are essentially being forced to collude in an experimental approach towards children with gender dysphoria”. She adds: “You can support children and accept them, without affirming their belief that their body is ‘wrong’.”

Adele Robinson (not her real name), a head of year at a secondary school, shares Davies-Arai’s worries. The school has had 12 children, all girls, come out as transgender in the past 18 months. The majority, she says, have autism, and some have experienced sexual abuse.

When they come out, she says, they have brought in information sourced from Tumblr blogs and YouTube videos. Although her team does its best to “support every child in a loving, kind and compassionate way”, she feels that staff are too frightened to challenge what she sees as harmful practices: “We have chest binders worn in school, which is horrible. If a child was cutting, they would be straight in with a counsellor. Yet damaging developing breast tissue goes unquestioned. It’s a gross failure in terms of child protection.” (continues)

www.theguardian.com/education/2018/may/15/transgender-row-teachers-afraid-challenge-breast-binding

Datun I think that the 'memorandum of understanding' prevents much discussion

It's unbelievably dangerous.

Where else would you have any kind of treatment that said, come on let's just go straight to life altering surgery?

Also worth watching Patrick's recent videos, he's very eloquent:

'Detransition (in English) - My reasons and the risks of transitioning'

'Detransition (in English) - Why gender-affirming therapy is dangerous!'
www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=919&v=51ymDtHByGE

Getting any cosmetic surgery or even a tattoo should at least come.with a "are you sure you want to do this?". An objective practitioner, not one trying to sell the idea to you.

Especially when the idea is being pushed onto vulnerable people.

Meanwhile in Argentina at the international WPATH event, Susie Green (CEO Memaids) twitter comment:

current thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3414279-Can-we-talk-about-WPATH

'If I didn't have a vagina I couldn't be raped' compounds my theory about trans to the letter.

Meanwhile I want to give Lee a big hug because telling that story was fucking brave x

"Let's be less concerned about certainty"???????

It's not even as though anyone agrees what 'trans' means, but apparently major life changing surgery with no clear outcome and permanent medication is always the best solution.

This is one thing I’m concerned about for the future

How many children who are transitioning right now suddenly realise years down the line that they were “in the right body” all along.

The parents are going to get such a flack for it and I can see a lot of court cases in the future

How many children who are transitioning right now suddenly realise years down the line that they were “in the right body” all along.

Or at the very least a body with organs that worked and functioned without the need for constant access to drugs.

Shorter Susie - If we ruin people's lives then that's fine as long as we claim that we meant well!

"Looking back now I realise that it was simply a feeling that if I didn't have a vagina, I couldn't be raped,"

My goodness that’s just heartbreaking. my heart goes out to Lee - that really is a brave story to tell. I hope they can get all the medical and psychological support they need.

I am aghast that medical professionals are allowing, pushing even, medical and surgical life changing procedures on people who have complex ptsd and other issues. This is so wrong.

But yes. Lawsuits.

Interesting info on what the press is dealing with in reporting on this stuff, thanks!

“if he did not have a vagina anymore he could not be raped.”

I used to volunteer on a support helpline and I heard that exact phrasing from more than one young woman/girl/transboy struggling with gender identity & comorbid mental health issues. Personally, I don’t think a history of sexual abuse would be terribly uncommon in young trans-identifying born-females, sadly.

Brava to Karen/Lee for speaking up and sharing her story, she deserves to be listened to. The system has let her down horrifically. And for what? Why? Who benefits?

Looking back now I realise that it was simply a feeling that if I didn't have a vagina, I couldn't be raped
This is just tragic. She tried to cut off her own breasts - WHY are other reasons not investigated first, before they mutilate perfectly healthy bodies. There are going to be more and more of these cases.

As for Susie Green's tweet, if it's fine to be trans - be proud of it and call yourself a transwoman or transman.

And having your body permanently altered is definitely a negative outcome if the person isn't actually trans but is traumatised. It would make their suffering even worse.
Transitioning should be the last option, not the first one.

This has upset me so much, I'm glad she is speaking out

So sorry to hear about everything that Lee has been put through and wishing her the very best for the future.

This is heartbreaking. I hope Lee can find peace (and a surgical outcome that is easier to live with).

I just wanted to respond to this thread in relation to people asking well how do you know, in years to come you might change your mind. we all get asked this and the honest answer is I don't know. I am doing something that the world is not designed for and that every one around me does not expect or really wants me to do, why would you do this unless you had too when everything is telling you not too. its hard to explain feeling this way probably like the people who think they have one arm to many it is my reality I did not get a choice in this and there is no other 'treatment' for this that works it does not go away even for the people who learn to live with it and don't transition or that do. the thing is we know we are not biologically the same no matter how much we wish it was, this 'treatment' is not perfect but it helps us live our lives the best we can. how can any of us know if this is right, its impossible too we just choose the things that help us function best in our lives and if one day that changes or it does not work then I will do what is needed to help me continue to live my life. transaction is not magic it's just a choice to help you live the best life you can, or any life at all.

I don't expect anyone in here to understand that or even respect that view. but none the less it is mine and it is valid. we can debate for a lifetime about why we exsist or what we should do but the fact is we do exsist and we would like to try and live the best lives we can in a society that helps us do that.

Actually Bespin, I think pretty much everyone on here will respect that view and sympathise and agree that gender dysphoria is analogous with conditions whereby people want a limb cut off for no rational reason.

What people on here don't accept is that such treatment turns you into the opposite sex.

Also people on here generally don't believe that children or adults should be set on a path that uses what should be the treatment of last resort as the first step before help with mental health and in the case of children, allowing them to grow up first.

@Bespin

Surely you can see that in the case of this person, transitioning was the wrong choice? She was repeatedly mis-diagnosed and will suffer for life as a result. 

I can totally see that this was the wrong choice for them and they could have been helped better but no one diagnoses anyone with this there are no tests you can take all that people do is allow you to validate how you feel there is a misunderstanding that doctors can tell you your trans and that if they don't done how your not in the years that I saw them all they did was asked me if I was a woman in various ways and helped eventually facilitate treatment for me. this is on the whole a self diagnosed condition and that does mean we can be wrong. I 100% agree that our reasons should he explored and do worry about the effects of trauma on people. I had a successful transition but in done respects I'm lucky though I do have a nerve issue due to surgery. as I said this is not perfect but this was the best I could do. others I know were not so lucky but that does not mean that being trans is the lesser option. it is about finding peace within yourself something that no treatment can do in its own. we all do things to ourselves that we have to find a way to live with the good and the bad I am fully aware that one day I may not feel like this but I can not see it.

Bespin have you read the thread?

Please do because context matters.

A woman has bravely spoken out altruistically.

She has been terribly abused and failed.

This is about her story.

The responses on the thread are empathic.

Let's not make this one about you please.

sorry for the spelling it's late and in not sleeping. under all this debate are just people who are trying to make the best of there lives. no one should ever claim that they change sex I spent years trying to get sex change to not be used in the media and I dislike the word transsexual for that reason this is not about being the same but about equivalence of experiences. I believe we have far more in common than we do diffence