Backlash on Twitter

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www.trendsmap.com/twitter/tweet/1054420444164444160

I think it's helpful to understand the concept of 'gender', so as to be aware of stereotypes and the need for protections against discrimination of GNC people.

Simplistically... transwomen are transwomen and male, but they should be able to go about their lives safely presenting as they wish. A Bunce should get a job regardless of whether interviewed wearing a suit with trousers or a skirt. This doesn't mean making women's spaces 'inclusive', it means making male spaces safe, or providing an alternative if that's impossible.

Like PPs, I'm apprehensive about a backlash that might reduce rights for LGB as it's not unusual in history to the point where it's common enough that it's known as Thermidorian reaction.

For historians of revolutionary movements, the term Thermidor has come to mean the phase in some revolutions when power slips from the hands of the original revolutionary leadership and a radical regime is replaced by a more conservative regime, sometimes to the point where the political pendulum may swing back towards something resembling a pre-revolutionary state.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermidorian_Reaction

"not a single TRA rushed to rescue women. So shove it up your hairy arses".

loving the comments

Wow, it's like a catharsis on there, isn't it. And a good answer to those who keep claiming it's only us 'mumsnutters' who don't agree that TWAW. No it isn't.

Like PPs, I'm apprehensive about a backlash that might reduce rights for LGB as it's not unusual in history to the point where it's common enough that it's known as Thermidorian reaction.

Yes, exactly. We need the sensible left to wake up and take courage before it's all too late.

Yes, my feeling is getting in bed with the right wing is not desirable at all. I have found myself reading the spectator, the times and links to the mail recently - something I never thought I would do. However, they are the only media that are taking the threat to women seriously. We really do need the left to step up now. SOON.

Interesting I will have to google Thermidorian Reaction, I've never heard that term before. Always good to learn something new. That said would it be such a bad thing if "things" shifted back a bit towards conservative? I do mean a bit, because nobody wants to live under extreme conservatism. I'm probably not wording this well, what I'm trying to say is a bit back towards the centre.

LangCleg I think in the UK you have a good chance of the sensible left waking up, thanks to the tireless efforts of some wonderfully stubborn women. In Australia and New Zealand there will be more of a effort required.

Frankly imo the US will struggle, their society seems to be so celebrity oriented. Celebrities that rely on maintaining popularity, and honestly would not have a clue about life for the everyday people. Too many issues the left and right are at odds over, gun control, immigration. Even if they had concerns about the erosion of women's rights - the election has left such a toxic environment they would not acknowledge something they perceive as right wing talking points. You just have to see the accusations of GC women's groups in the U.K. being connected to the evangelicals in the US.

I will definitely read up on this. But it seems to me historically (I'm by no means a historian) that when there is an imbalance politically to extremism on either side society (at least in western countries) strives to correct it back to a more central position.

Like PPs, I'm apprehensive about a backlash that might reduce rights for LGB

I think this is slightly less likely in one sense, as there has been a great growth in lesbian allyship, a new understanding of the discrimination they suffer and a deep respect for the way they have led this campaign. I think there are many more people who have the L's back.

Such a vote winner for trump. After the disgusting brett kavanaugh performance, it's nauseating to welcome anything he does or says. But he's damn right about needing to define 'sex' in law, and it's only because of transactivism that the need came about at all.

Wow.... I LOVE reading that outpouring of rage..... so many .... so clear... so angry.

I think Triump's timing might be perfect for the UK enabling politicians over here to understand a little of what happens when trans goes haywire......

At least I hope so ....much as I loathe the man I will be so pleased if he is good for something, even unintentionally

Well done women for seeing the emperor's new clothes. We'll see how long it takes our politicians to notice now.

Interesting I will have to google Thermidorian Reaction, I've never heard that term before. Always good to learn something new. That said would it be such a bad thing if "things" shifted back a bit towards conservative? I do mean a bit, because nobody wants to live under extreme conservatism. I'm probably not wording this well, what I'm trying to say is a bit back towards the centre.

The thing is, a Thermidorian Reaction is not just a slight shift back to a more centred, post-revolutionary midpoint. It literally describes a pendulum swing back to something every bit as conservative as the original, pre-revolutionary point - so in this case the danger is a more general LGBT backlash. It would be nice if, with that in mind, TRAs stopped to think about what they need to do to win mainstream hearts and minds, as right now the doxxing/silencing/gloating about erasing women isn't doing such a great job.

That's my fear too. I've talked to relatives who're blaming all the trans bollocks on gay people and developing a very negative attitude towards anything LGB as a result. It's one of the reasons why I think the gay orgs need to actively distance themselves from TRAs.

Of course they're all currently doing the exact opposite. I'm very left but could live with a slight return to center. I'm not sure how well any of us could live with a violent swing to the right, which is what's likely to happen if the left doesn't regain its senses soon.

a Thermidorian Reaction is not just a slight shift back to a more centred, post-revolutionary midpoint. It literally describes a pendulum swing back to something every bit as conservative as the original, pre-revolutionary point - so in this case the danger is a more general LGBT backlash

^^ This is my concern. People who are fundamentally opposed to many of the gains in civil rights over the last 50 years would seize an opportunity to modify/reduce and, over time, undo them as much as possible.

We're in danger of groups of people losing their civil rights because a group wants us to sleep walk into totalitarianism. And the people with the current political clout to stop that are also those people who would push us towards totalitarianism.

Thing is, the problem isn't just with the Corbynistas - the 'sensible' Left have been more silent than most on this issue.

Over to you Yvette Cooper / Andy Burnham / Chuka Umunna.

It's terrifying to consider the backlash. I've seen it among some of the right-leaning people I follow and I'm convinced this is someone's deliberate strategy. Control. It's quite clear that there is no one who is not considered fair game for some people - women, LGB oriented people, transsexuals, children and on it goes.

And they've packaged it all in rainbow coloured ribbons and words like love and inclusion, because no one will notice poison when it's hidden in good things.

The posters on that Twitter thread are a sign of hope because they show that there are people seeing through the manipulation. But it's not going to be nearly enough to break open a movement that has the backing of the establishment and has clearly been in the planning for some time.

That's Jenn Smith's point of concern; that the people in power aren't stupid so why are they backing this? His concern is that it could lead to a more conservative, or even a totalitarian, regime gaining power in the guise of fixing this mess.

the people in power aren't stupid so why are they backing this?

I'd argue that they're not stupid, but they are very, very busy, and preoccupied with a huge number of other issues that they're supposed to be informed about, and they regard this one as relatively unimportant, so they haven't been informing themselves about it in any depth. Which of course has to be true of a lot of issues that people with power deal with, just because there is so much to deal with and know about.

They link it to gay rights, and see it as similar, something that will gain them credit for being caring, modern, open-minded conservatives. And why wouldn't they, with Stonewall using their huge popularity/ respect to insist on that link? Most of them will be unaware of the actual facts, and just accepting that if Stonewall is backing it, it must be OK.

And don't forget that there are lots of lesbian/gay/bi people who are conservative voters: sexual orientation has a strong innate component, so there's no reason to believe it's linked to political affiliation. So they'll be thinking about that as well.

Thanks PineappleSunrise for the explanation. I did google had never heard the term before. Yeah nobody wants Gilead for women and Saudi Arabia for LGBT.

That's my fear too. I've talked to relatives who're blaming all the trans bollocks on gay people and developing a very negative attitude towards anything LGB as a result. It's one of the reasons why I think the gay orgs need to actively distance themselves from TRAs.

And there are others who are blaming it on feminists. They mean the faux feminist third wave twits who have been supporting transgenderism, but they don't distinguish. They lay the blame at the feet of all feminists, including us.

Feminists get the blame for all the crap men dole out to women because we are apparently not doing enough to stop men from abusing us.

Yeah, it is the fault of Julie Bindel that any man who chooses to listens to her would then become violent.

The solution to ending violence is to stop her speaking.

Blimey. That's the kind of response Debbie H and Rose of Dawn worried about. What a mess.

TRAs bullied and batshitted all over the place. Shutting down debate. Compromise will be so hard to reach now. It's a bloody mess. Bunch of tossers.