Backlash on Twitter

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www.trendsmap.com/twitter/tweet/1054420444164444160

Well this is amazing. I don't go on Twitter, I only look at it when someone on MN posts a link to a page.

How is it that saying thinks like "terfs can suck my lady dick" isn't banned on Twitter? I don't use it but I am genuinely astounded that they are allowed to post things like that.

Is racism allowed on there too? Or just sexism and homophobia?

Fuck me that was a brilliant read 

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.

Talk With Twitter, men can say pretty much anything and get away with it.

A woman calls a trans woman a man, and she's suspended.

Backlash aside, what is being proposed in the US is very retrogressive & not something I would support over here. It seems to be heading off in the other extreme. I do believe people find the concept of gender identity helpful, I just don’t believe it should be lauded above sex category, nor ignored completely.
Fucking Trump and the GOP.

Thanks for posting that. I have been so immersed in the UK situation that I assumed the US was hopeless by comparison. That thread is giving me hope, and it is so good to read women expressing our anger. I'm not on twitter but fwiw:

I was an ally, until I was told that my abortion was transphobic, the way I talk about my period is transphobic... And until I saw young lesbians being given basically two choices: chop up your body or let men f**k you... Nah mate. You're on your own.

👊 Brilliant

Empress isn't the definition of stupidity doing the same thing over and over but expecting to get a different result?

Sounds about right, Ancient. They seem so blinkered.

Well, erm, what a thread.

In all honesty, I am sorry this is happening in America, hopefully it will not go as far as most TRAs would wish upon women. I don't want to see anyone hurt, and I suspect the true victims will be the old school transsexuals. And for all our sakes, I hope we are headed for some sense of sanity over here. Just not nastiness, I would hate that our true friends get hurt. Just all the pretending ones scurrying back to obscurity. That would be good, and then we can ready for the next battle we have to fight.

EmpressAdultHumanFemale

Empress isn't the definition of stupidity doing the same thing over and over but expecting to get a different result?

Sounds about right, Ancient. They seem so blinkered.

The famous quote, misattributed to Einstein, is "the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results"

I wouldn't dare risk a deletion for suggesting that our friendly TRAs/AWAs are insane.

I know too much about this movement now, I know too much about what trans ideology stands for, I can't support it.

Hear, bloody hear!

I’m torn right now. Happy to see a return to sex segregation instead of gender, and that thread is positive: lesbians have every right to be angry.

But I’m wary of Trump as an ally. Lisa Muggeridge said a while back that the danger in this uprising would be one of overswing. I hope that lesbian and gay rights are not rolled back, due to their links with T. Also hope there isn’t a swing further that increases the problems of genuine transsexuals.

Like flippinn, I hope for sanity over there and over here, not nastiness.

Like flippinn, I hope for sanity over there and over here, not nastiness

Agree

But the thread is a perfect example of how aggressive and bullying language can backfire...some very angry people on there, and I can't blame them at all

Many of us on here have been predicting a right wing backlash for some time - the day will come when extremist transactivists rue the day that they did not seek consensus with feminists. The problem is that such a backlash will fuck things up for a great many people besides them.

I’m on Twitter a lot. Lots of my Twitter friends there. Their comments, as others have said, are angry but not impolite. The women on Twitter are fabulous, just like the women here.

They don't care. They are floating agitists - they will be weeping and wailing 'saving the world' another way next week.

Look I don't wish trump on anyone. But what is happening in that thread is a perfect response to someone who has been abusive to you and then asks you for something.

Most of the gay men I know (some lesbians too) are either very pro trans and (still) see it as the same as gay rights, or they are frozen with paralysis, overwhelmed and don't know what to do. Only a few few have "got it". Stonewall have always been their good guys.

This is all very upsetting to me - now I have outed myself as GC (should be obvious) I am risking losing many friends.

So to hear so many gay men and women say " nah, we see you" is a big boost in my day.

The gay men I know think it's a load of nonsense - and are wary of transvestites (find them a bit scary actually). The lesbians I know are pretty pissed off. Parents of girls are really pissed off.

The route the DoJ is trying to take in the US is harmful & wrong I believe. But that thread shows that there is a huge gulf between opposing harmful legislation, and speaking up as a vocal trans ally. Just because we believe discrimination against transgender people is wrong, doesn’t mean we swallow the ideology hook line & sinker.

Like flippinn, I hope for sanity over there and over here, not nastiness

Yes. Return to sex segregation of spaces and services which need segregation. An end to 'no debate' and the propagation of unscientific tosh. Safeguarding of children.
Proper diagnosis and appropriate treatment for any (child or adult) who needs it. Appropriate anti discrimination laws to protect gender nonconformists.

Trump (acting largely, I assume, to appease the religious right in the US) may get the first of those back but may not care much about the rest. That's bad... but it's not the fault of the people (mostly lesbians) who the TRAs threw under the bus who are now rebelling against them.

I hope we can do better in the U.K. I hope the rational transsexuals who have predicted the backlash start to be heard by the powers that be, along with women.

I don't want to see anyone hurt, and I suspect the true victims will be the old school transsexuals

I know why you've said that and I agree that there will be a backlash against transsexuals but while I don't want to see that, no I think the true victims are still women.

It's women who are vulnerable and who are being assaulted and threatened and raped. I can care about both parties because I don't want anyone being hurt but I know where my main concern lies.

Good, I’m glad to see so many lesbians saying no.

I’ve got to the point now where I’m preying for the backlash to hit. The sooner it comes, the less damage will have been done, so less of us will get dragged in I hope. Lesbians have nothing to do with the TRA agenda, most of us don’t support it, so I’m more fussed about saving my own skin at this point.

As for the abusive TRAs, and all the people who stood by and said nothing, tough shit, you’ve made you’re bed, enjoy lying in it. I for one won’t be shedding any tears for you.

Genuinely interested - "I do believe people find the concept of gender identity helpful,"

As someone who doesn't have this feeling I find it hard to understand - obviously really! I can believe that others have it - I'm an atheist but understand and accept that others have spiritual feelings, ditto for having a "minds eye" that I recently found out was actually seeing stuff as I can't do that either.

How and why is the concept of gender ID useful? Sex dysphoria is different, again, I get that. So not about sex but gender, gender ID, I genuinely can't see the concept as anything other than regressive - "ladybrain"- and vast amounts of output from trans orgs and trans people say this is what it is to.

No one has ever asked the general public if they have this feeling. Trans people do, by definition, but this has been extrapolated to everyone. I don't think it's correct.

Also for women who are feminist, many of us became feminists because when we were young we noticed we were treated "like women" or " like girls" and we didn't like it, we wanted to be treated like people. Trans ideology says that "cis" women and girls like to be treated that way, and to treat anyone who indicates that they want to be seen as female another way is an insult. Many women are it all as extraordinarily regressive.

I am really interested to know how it's helpful. And how helpful is it if in fact most people are "agender" "non binary " etc

’m wary of Trump as an ally. Lisa Muggeridge said a while back that the danger in this uprising would be one of overswing

I agree with this brings to mind that poem about 'First they came for the Communists and I didn't speak out because I was not a Communist' - lets face it Trump is going to do nothing for women's rights - in fact he is busy putting those in danger too.

On the other hand some of this anger is righteous, these are people who started out (like many of us) as natural supporters of trans people but who had that support thrown back in their faces accompanied with rape threats and 'enjoy your erasure' merely for talking about safeguarding or acknowledging biological differences and how they mean something to women (periods, pregnancy, menopause, endometriosis and so on) . So I get it, I get why people are angry so am I and I do understand why so many lesbians don't want to help when they were tossed under that bus without a second thought.

Supporting Trump or extreme right wing on the other hand is problematic because for women particularly they might be in the group he comes after next. Tricky because I understand completely the 'fuck you' attitude on that thread and why that attitude exists.

As an aside I find 'gender' unhelpful, I believe it is a collection of stereotypes and culturally acceptable expectations and social mores. I think it is inherently harmful to women and men to be pigeonholed in that fashion and the world would be a better place if more of those expectations and prejudices were ignored and we let people just be who they are. That's just my take on gender though and it has been for many years.

Like NothingOnTellyAgain I find the concept of gender identity very unhelpful. I can't define it in any meaningful way. I get as far as "a desire to adopt the stereotypical behaviours and appearance of the opposite sex" and then can't go any further.

Unless you're going to go down the route of pseudo science but I'm not willing to do that.