The feminist case against anti-trans feminism

[spannablue]

Sorry to have been away for a bit- work got busy and my DS3 had flu.
Anyway I thought this might be interesting

www.versobooks.com/blogs/4090-i-m-not-transphobic-but-a-feminist-case-against-the-feminist-case-against-trans-inclusivity

I gather Germaine is busy writing new material as we speak - the recent revival of interest in her work has given the guru renewed vigour.

I imagine it won't be a recipe book.

You know, writing about Natacha Kennedy, this male transactivist who is employed at Glodsmith as both, a man and a woman at the same time, using two different names, the pronoun use they/them for one single biological person has made sense to me for the first time.

That article was virtually unreadable.

I think we need a name for this moment in time.

I propose the ‘The Second Wave of Second Wave Feminism’

Two to the power of two aka 2^2 Wave feminism = 4th Wave feminism?

Feminism with capital F, of course.

I imagine it won't be a recipe book.

Bunbury has a great recipe for lemon drizzle actually. Check it out.

Trans women are not a subset of anything.

Transsexuals = men with gender dysphoria
Trans women = men with AGP / sexual paraphillias / non-medicalised "gender feelz"

Trans women are NOT women. How hard is this to understand.

As a transsexual I want my own identity thank you, not be a subset of anyone elses.

Hi five for Hamster

and respect for anyone who carves out their own identity, without trying to impose themselves onto an oppressed group without consent.

Hi five for Hamster

and respect for anyone who carves out their own identity, without trying to impose themselves onto an oppressed group without consent.

Seconded. The nonchalance with which the pomos try to erase women and transsexuals no matter what we say and destroy language in the process is really something to behold.

I find it seriously depressing when people refer to pro-woman feminism as 'anti-trans'. I mean, how can one be a feminist at all if you are not pro-woman?! Surely the only kind of feminism is centering women rather than men?

I find it seriously depressing when people refer to pro-woman feminism as 'anti-trans'. I mean, how can one be a feminist at all if you are not pro-woman?! Surely the only kind of feminism is centering women rather than men?

Those same people cannot even define 'woman', 'female' and who knows how may other words they use in their manifesti Not even should their lives depend on it. So, what do you expect?

97% OP.

Sorry to have been away for a bi

No need to apologise: we got on just fine in your absence.

As in 97% of people who answered the poll in the Times, haven't fallen for your chat.

As in 97% of people who answered the poll in the Times, haven't fallen for your chat.

It is not like Pomos care about what the people want - except in order to gauge how difficult it will be to subvert the people's will.

Charming! What a bastion of reasoned debate

Pot

Kettle

Black

I actually read this when I came across it as I am pretty new to this and wanted to see it it could make a good case. It was the same waffly drivel Mumsnetters have deconstructed many times before. Thank you for the recommendation but I have yet to see any article explain how it is possible for human beings to change sex.

Don't feel you need to apologize for your absence, Spanna. Really. Don't give it another thought. Not at all necessary.

But you'll have to forgive me for having zero interest in your OP.

How can transwomen be a subset of women if nobody can explain why they are in the set called women in the first place?

Materialist, you're right. People will be very angry with any government which passes Self ID. It's hugely unpopular.

When I've been out leafletting for FPFW only once has someone said they didn't agree out of many dozens who took the leaflets over a number of days.

What was striking was the number of people of both sexes (though mostly women) who came back, having read the leaflet, to ask questions. A lot could hardly believe it was true. All were horrified. A very young man talked to us at length. His sister is a lesbian and he's angry about the hassle she gets from males who identify as lesbians. He said it's homophobic

We also chatted with a transsexual with a GRC who supported us. And it's not just my personal experience that suggests the public don't want Self ID. The Times ran a survey and found 97% of readers opposed it.

Materialist your robust argument has revived me after feeling quite wilted over this GRA consultation. Thanks for that. :)

Prawnofthepatriarchy that is also good to hear. Your experience must be so heartening. If all you do is read about this online you can feel rather battered, so activism is clearly the way forward!

If we think of transwomen as a subset of millionaires all we have to do is give them money to make it true.

Self ID is being pushed by a party that once thought the poll tax was a great idea and that everyone would eventually come round to it.