More Guardian gaslighting

[irishfeminist]

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/08/women-men-curfew-danger-fear

An article about the relative vulnerability of women out in the world and the lack of understanding men have.

Leading with a quote from DANIELLE FUCKING MUSCATO about that female experience.

Danielle - bearded, taking a place in a women's refuge,"Suck my dick" - Muscato.

We are being trolled and mocked on a daily basis.

I see we're still using female pronouns for big 'ole Dan

super

apparently words have no meaning anymore

yes, DM is seething with rage for sure

just not rage about the injustices visited on women

DM is seething with rage against women

DM's every action reveals it

So Muscato is able to tell everyone how awful it is to be a woman, from their 4 years experience since coming out as trans? Before then, Muscato was walking around carefree after 9pm, but now they have a dress, they can tell everyone about male privilege:
Because every time we try to help you understand that your male privilege harms us, it goes in one ear and out the other.
All we want is for men to see that we are people. It's really not too much to ask. But the only way it will ever happen is if men listen to us and start seeing that we're people. And start teaching their sons that we are people.
What if Rachel Dolzeal had tweeted something similar about being a black woman? I still can't see how one is considered awful, but this is "oh what an amazing and new idea that no other woman has ever mentioned".

I saw this article. Googled to see if it was the same Danielle. Yup. Googled to see if anyone else had picked up on who danielle was beyond an 'activist' who sent a tweet that went viral. Nothing. Couldn't understand it at all. Shook my head and got on with my day. Epic gaslighting.

As for it being a good point, well if course it is, but context is all: DM is not saying this because it reflects Dam's lived experience, DM is saying this as an act of appropriation.

(For some reason it reminds me of the Punch cartoon of the boardroom with one woman in it: "that's a good point MissTriggs, perhaps one of the men would like to make it?")

There's a reason there's no picture of that person in that piece. That person is built like a brick shithouse

What annoys me most is that by DM's own ideology the curfew would change nothing, because any bloke would just self-ID as a woman- like DM - and thus avoid the curfew. Changing nothing for women compared to the current curfew-free world.

I mean... muscato is trolling us all, right? How anyone can use female pronouns or take anything they say seriously is beyond me.
It's like a 4chan greentext joke, I'm waiting for the punchline...

Still. I'm tempted to link this piece side by side with the 'suck my dick' tweet & a pic, ought to be a conversation starter!

The twitter comments are funny though. I think the writer (no propose photo - hope the beard has gone) was on a bit of a rant.

Why listen to that person anyway. Them's not nice people. Are they trying for a writing or polical career?

So, Muscato asks the ladies, what we would do, if men had a 9 hour curfew. The obvious answer: nothing. Cause the men, in all their bearded glory, will declare themselves women and that‘s that.

Muscato sure means well here, but talk about cognitive dissonance.

Correct.

They are quite an aggressive type who - based on past tweets and actions - is quite 'forceful in the idea of the magic of themselves'. Man or woman - I'd run.

Danielle muscato wouldn't be any less safe walking out after 9pm than any other male bodied person.

So what's more important the question being asked or who asked it?

Regardless of who posted it I think it is good to have such an eye-opening thing to have circulating around. It will start conversations. It happened to be muscatos tweet because it went viral.

I don't think you can separate the two questions out
The behaviour of Danielle muscato and that ilk directly contributes to the erosion of women's safety. The fact that Danielle asked this question isn't incidental; it's part of a campaign to be validated and included as a woman.
The fact that the thread wouldn't have gone viral if it had been posted by Jane bloggs without a huge twitter platform is relevant, since Danielle obtained that twitter platform by appropriating female experiences.

The fact that Danielle asked this question isn't incidental; it's part of a campaign to be validated and included as a woman.
The fact that the thread wouldn't have gone viral if it had been posted by Jane bloggs without a huge twitter platform is relevant, since Danielle obtained that twitter platform by appropriating female experiences

Yes. Spot on. Plus DM has now appropriated even our oppression when, in my book, that individual is very much part of the problem. We've always been silenced. Now we have individuals who tell us to suck cock speaking not only for us, but as us. I'm not enjoying my erasure.

Let's imagine someone who's never thought about women not feeling safe walking around at night reads that article, or the viral tweet. Maybe he's starting to think about it, maybe even attempted empathy. And then he somehow sees a photo of Muscato linked as the person who wrote the original tweet.

My guess is he bursts out laughing. Does he connect that sense of absurdity to the ideas themselves and shuffle them into the "bloody feminists moaning" category rather than the "this person specifically is mental" category? He may well.

The Guardian article is good. It's a shame it's pegged on that Muscato tweet. Did anybody point out in the Twitter thread that Muscato was a man?

Not a fan of DM but don't see the issue with this at all. DM is being a good ally to women and raising awareness of an important issue.

If a woman posted this tweet there wouldn't be a problem.

If a man posted this tweet there wouldn't be a problem.

The fact it was posted by a trans woman isnt gaslighting. Her Twitter profile makes it very clear she's trans. Why should trans women feel ashamed to highlight issues affecting all women?

Positive solidarity and all that.

That answers a question for me in terms of whether even people who're entirely onboard with all the gender stuff regard Muscato as a bit of an embarrassment.

@MNHQ it would be helpful to understand in what way my post at 06:43 violated talk guidelines

As I recall it had a picture of Danielle Muscato and mentioned that it was a shame the guardian were only interested in women's safety when highlighted by a male

ah

light dawns

it's so hard to stay within talk guidelines here when you get deleted for stating self evident truths

I promise I wasn't trying to be goady, it was early and I temporarily forgot the need for double speak

hands up who looks at Danielle Muscato and thinks 'woman'? I really resent the implication that being able to tell someones sex is transphobic

I think being on board with gender stuff doesn't mean one has to like or admire everybody who is transgender.

Same as being on board with feminism doesn't mean liking or admiring all females.

Dommina, Danielle definitely appears to be including herself in the thread. See below.

Why should trans women feel ashamed to highlight issues affecting all women?

Because it doesn't actually affect Danielle in the slightest. Far be it from me to question Danielle's womanhood, but to the unwokened eye, Danielle is completely indistinguishable from a man. Danielle doesn't get treated like a woman when walking down the street - Danielle is treated like a man.

So Danielle's use of the "we" pronoun when talking about issues that affect women precisely because they are visibly female, is, to some tastes, a bit fucking much.

I've found that the kind of male humans who I'm comfortable being in enclosed spaces with generally don't tell women they're angry with to suck their cocks.