Have Scouts said anything about Assistant leader 'Baloo' Challenor?

[Doyenne]

Just wondering whether the Scout Association have made any sort of announcement re their assistant leader being charged. They will have been told by the police at the very latest when he was charged so they have had plenty of time to prepare a statement

*no mention

I can understand why people are wary of Scouts because of this. I have reason to be wary of a certain type of Cadet Corps, but can I just point out that one of my children was sexually abused for years by a relative and didn't tell us until long after the person died. A fine upstanding person (we thought).
Much better to teach children protective behaviours. You can't stop them from joining things in case they meet a wrong un. After all they go to school every day and we put enormous trust in teachers, some of whom have been found to be up to no good.

EDBS can show surprising things unless you apply to have items omitted: Driven to suicide as a result of an enhanced DBS certificate – the problem with the disclosure of police intelligence

[X] got the job and was told that she would need an enhanced Disclosure and Barring Service check. [She was allowed to start work as long as she applied for it immediately.]

Several weeks later her DBS certificate arrived and on it, disclosed under the ‘additional information’ section was her Penalty Notice for Disorder (PND) for a public order offence. [X] had received this whilst she was at university and on a night out with three of her fellow students...[X] had a strange feeling [men they passed] might be undercover police officers so jokingly as she walked past them, she made a pig-like noise.

One of them grabbed [X's] arm and told her that she had committed a public order offence by ‘making a pig-like noise in the vicinity of a police officer.’ They told her that if she accepted a Penalty Notice for Disorder (PND) and a fine she would avoid having to go to court. Believing that this was her best option, [X] accepted the PND.

[X] thought that was the end of the matter but of course as her enhanced DBS certificate was to show it most certainly was not. When she took the document to her employer, they told her that she’d acted dishonestly in not disclosing the PND and she was instantly dismissed.

You know the rest from the title of the report.

From discussions elsewhere, I believe a CRB check does not find pending charges. So though Challenor was out on bail for three years, it's only once he's found guilty that it will turn up on the police check.

However, it is/should be part of every application for such a post whether they* have anything pending that would cause alarm or bring the organisation into disrepute. Not watertight but at least they can then be done for fraud or something.

• they or anyone in their house. Which is why Aimee Challenor is at fault. .

It's so sad to read 'I wouldn't send my child to scouts' etc because of this. The media always seem to highlight scouting child abuse cases over many others. I've even noticed dramas on tv will drop in the occasional scouting reference when covering child abuse. It's seriously damaging to the organisation. When teachers are convicted for child abuse you don't have parents saying 'i can't bare to send my child into a school'. It's so grossly unfair. I am NOT excusing any failings on the part of the scouting association nor am I minimising this mans behaviour. BUT making sweeping generalisations about the whole organisation and refusing to send children there is so unfair and damaging.

And yes. All leaders have to re do DBS checks every five years regardless of when they joined.

It is bizarre because it is only very recently (and I mean within last few months) that some occupations no longer lose their jobs through the wrongdoing of a family member or resident in the same home: disqualification through association]].

July 2018 – The Department of Education published its response, (amending the childcare disqualification arrangements in schools and non-domestic registered settings pdf), to the consultation that it announced in May 2016. It agreed disqualification by association in schools and registered non-domestic childcare settings should be removed. Therefore, from the 1st September 2018 schools are no longer required to ask their staff questions about unspent relevant convictions of someone living in their household. We will be publishing an updated information page when the new regulation is enacted on the 1st September 2018.

Well I've just had an email from our scout group asking about DBS checks All parents need one.

Lilly I'm guessing from the way you've worded your post (correct me if I'm wrong) that you're involved in scouting in some official capacity.

Can you answer the question I posed upthread: when people first volunteer, do they actually sign a piece of paper agreeing that, should they be investigated for a serious crime (sexual or violent) in between DBS checks, they should disclose this immediately and step back from their volunteer activities until such time as the investigation is satisfactorily resolved?

Because what I want to know is: did the Scouts exercise due diligence? Okay, they can't pick up everyone, but what policies do they have in place to try to pick up on these things in between DBS checks?

LillyBugg that's why Scouts have to come clean about DC, to rebuild parents trust and quickly.

I’m a bit shocked that DBS only has to be done every five years. Tbh I would expect it to be done annually.

arranfan - that's scary. Who signed off on that change, I wonder, and due to what pressure.

Don't get me wrong - most of the time I am dead against "guilt by association". But there are a small range of exceptions - where someone chooses to remain living with a convicted child sex offender for instance, they are not suitable people to be looking after other people's children, either as a teacher or a nursery worker. Because they have demonstrated their judgement to be so seriously up the creek that they are not to be trusted with safeguarding.

LillyBugg - agree with you. So many teachers are investigated and convicted of child abuse but people stilll send their children to school.

PersistAunt . An enchanted DBS check will show non conviction information ( including pending court case ) if relevant to their role. It is at the discretion of the police to do this.

My CRB (now DBS) with scouts had to be renewed every 3 years. Maybe this varies by troup though which isn’t very reassuring!

DBS can be done as often as a organisation dictates. Every three years in the organisation I am associated with.

There are , as said previously, other agencies involved in this process of ensuring children are safe besides the Scouts.

Did police inform the LADO of his arrest if he was involved with children ? Did LADO inform Scouts.?

If this didn't happen why not ? No point asking the Scouts.

Scouts haven't made a statement as they probably haven't been asked by press to make one.

DBS can be done as often as a organisation dictates. Every three years in the organisation I am associated with.

There are , as said previously, other agencies involved in this process of ensuring children are safe besides the Scouts.

Did police inform the LADO of his arrest if he was involved with children ? Did LADO inform Scouts.?

If this didn't happen why not ? No point asking the Scouts.

Scouts haven't made a statement as they probably haven't been asked by press to make one.

DBS can be done as often as a organisation dictates. Every three years in the organisation I am associated with.

There are , as said previously, other agencies involved in this process of ensuring children are safe besides the Scouts.

Did police inform the LADO of his arrest if he was involved with children ? Did LADO inform Scouts.?

If this didn't happen why not ? No point asking the Scouts.

Scouts haven't made a statement as they probably haven't been asked by press to make one.

Sorry for multi posting

Sorry for multi posting

Our Scout group ask for all parents to have DBS checks if they ever help out on camps, and they don't have to be staying at the camp e.g. helping cook meals/ helping on an activity.

I am a regular helper and have just had my DBS renewed, so for sure the leaders will have theirs renewed.

I think too many people rely on the DBS, it has become too much of a safety net. It only shows up convictions, so someone can be breaking the law but if they haven't been caught it won't show up. So just because all scout leaders, teachers etc have them done does not mean that some awful people will slip through the net. My understanding is that Jimmy Saville would have had a clean DBS as he had never been charged with anything.

I also think it is sad that people say they won't send their children to Scouts etc. Statistically your children are more at risk from family and friends. A friend of mine is a teacher so knows everything about safeguarding. Checked that any groups her DC joined followed all the rules. Then one day found out that a close friend, who had had contact with her children, was being charged in relation to sexual abuse against children. Luckily her children weren't involved but she had had no idea.

I know that opinion formers and politicians and their researchers read this forum.

LOOK AT WHAT IS BEING SAID.

Our safeguarding procedures are not comprehensive and often fail as it is. Yet extremist transactivism wants to dissolve and/or weaken them further. We evidence this here over and over. And yet government and big third sector money (hello Comic Relief, hello Children in Need) continues to be funnelled to these lobby groups even as they issue guidance which in some cases is unlawful.

FUCKING DO SOMETHING.

Co signed.

As a cub leader myself I’m interested to find out how or if this was missed (dates unconfirmed) the scouts will suspend from the point of arrest / being informed if they know about it.

Unfortunately there are bad people in all walks of life, over the past few years I’ve seen quiet shy kids develop into confident young people happy to jump of cliffs into the sea, do climbing, high ropes etc. I put my kids through a different group with different leaders and they had a lot of fun, made new friends and learnt plenty of new skills over the years

Beavers, Cubs, Scouts & Explorers are all run completely by volunteers who give up their time each week to plan and run the sessions and 99.999 percent are legit but you’ll always get the odd adult who has the wrong intentions whether that be in schools, football clubs etc .... when an adult joins they have to do a DBS check and an appointments committee where a group of adults talk to you and report any concerns.... pretty sure both these are renewed every 5 years

Are you encouraged to report on any misgivings you have about your volunteer colleagues, Lisa4225?

To quote LangCleg (again, because it cannot be said enough):

I know that opinion formers and politicians and their researchers read this forum.

LOOK AT WHAT IS BEING SAID.

Our safeguarding procedures are not comprehensive and often fail as it is. Yet extremist transactivism wants to dissolve and/or weaken them further. We evidence this here over and over. And yet government and big third sector money (hello Comic Relief, hello Children in Need) continues to be funnelled to these lobby groups even as they issue guidance which in some cases is unlawful.

FUCKING DO SOMETHING.

certainly in the scout group here, you have a DBS every 3 years, its a proper recruitment process with references and interviews, you all get safeguarding training, they don't do things like be alone with a child, they would expect you to report anything you were uncomfortable with to a safeguarding lead. if you have a 3 month break and aren't 'seen' you need another check. It seems just as professional as the school I work at.

Its not a foolproof system and I do wonder reading this is different in different areas.

Scouts haven't made a statement as they probably haven't been asked by press to make one.

Surely the Scouts should be proactive in this. That's why I said that I thought they should be sending out press releases to provide clarity and information in relation to DC's relationship with the Scouts - especially in relation to timescales and what, if any action, they have taken.

It may well be that DC has had no involvement with Scouting for a number of years, and his convictions for animal cruelty and now for the torture and rape of a little girl related to a time after he was with the Scouts. However, it is being reported that this man, convicted of sexual violence against a child has or had a leadership role in the Scouts.

And the Scouts are saying .... nothing.