I KNOW it's been asked before but I still don't understand ....

[BertrandRussell]

....why all these public organisations, the political parties, BHA, Liberty- everyone is just accepting that TWAW. What brought them to that conclusion? What was the thinking, the rationale? Some of these are groups that struggle with using Ms, ffs! How has it happened? When the first people came to them and said "From now on, we can self identify as a man or a woman, regardless of our biology and you must change your structures to reflect that" why did they say "OK then" not "Don't be silly"?

This,Bertrand is the $64,000 question I've been asking myself about this shit show since I hit peak trans many moons ago.

I don't understand it either but I don't know if that's as important as how we stop it and put it into reverse.

I wish I knew how...

Some of these are groups that struggle with using Ms, ffs!

Some of these organisations don't need that much encouragement to be misogynistic.

Supporting women's rights is obviously a lot harder than supporting the rights of other groups.

It's a perfect storm of narcissistic male entitlement, money, the co-opting of existing movements and identities, toxic social shaming mechanisms, violent silencing, power dynamics, misogyny, and a healthy dose of quasi-religious ideology that could almost be designed by L Ron Hubbard masquerading as pseudo-science.
Nobody dares utter the truth.

Spot on observation Carceral.

It truly is the perfect storm.

I'm with you OP. I just don't understand.
I was a midwife for 20 years and every single woman who gave birth had a vagina even if that wasn't the route the baby took into this world. Not one of those women had a penis. And aside of a baby with a serious developmental disorder it was very clear what sex each and every baby was. Not one was assigned a sex.
No one is going to tell me to ignore biology. Ever.

MAy 2018 thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3241837-Why-has-the-trans-lobby-been-so-successful

Public bodies are scared of being accused of some nasty -ism.

In their world life is quite safe and comfy. It’s hard to be told off, almost whatever you do. Getting the chop is unthinkable. A lifetime of telling other people what to do stretches before you. The ONLY exception to that is being accused of an “-ism”. It scared them witless.

I think political parties adopted it because they thought it would be another cheap way of looking good. The introduction of gay marriage was extremely cheap and uncomplicated, allowing governments to look like good guys with all the right-on feelings, without having to spend a penny.

Agree carceral, and Unrelenting.

Because it's coming down from way up high, the Parties can't ignore it.

3.The Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC)18 emphasised the importance of “a single, strong and clear strategy to lever progress”.19 Stonewall told us that “establishing a transparent mechanism for cross-government working, with a specific ‘trans equality’ remit, would provide a way to focus expertise and to consult with trans communities”.20 We also heard from various quarters the view that the UK government should adopt the overarching principles on trans equality embodied in two international declarations:21

the Yogyakarta Principles on the Application of International Human Rights Law in relation to Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity, adopted by the International Commission of Jurists in 2007;22 and
Resolution 2048: Discrimination against transgender people in Europe, adopted by the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe in April 2015.23

These set out an overarching framework for trans equality in law, based on the principle of a universal right for individuals to determine their own gender identity and to have this respected and recognised.

publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201516/cmselect/cmwomeq/390/39005.htm

The law of unintended consequences, perhaps? It's all been done with the best of intentions, but they didn't think it through.

Why is the Labour Party in its current meltdown? Ed Milliband's cheap-as-chips membership deal combined with the 'gentleman's agreement' of it being Corbyn's turn to stand as the token Trot in the leadership elections...and whaddya know, it's an unholy mess. And as (ex) Labour members here can testify, extraordinarily hard to rectify after the event.

Maybe MPs who have drunk the kool aid would understand that analogy.

Shelia Jeffreys spoke brilliantly about this at the last We Need To Talk meeting in London. She explains what the Yogyakarta Principles are, how they came about, and how we're seeing the implications play out now in the rapid rise of transgenderism ideology.

Add Stop Funding Hate to your list: I got crucified by men and women shouting TERF on one of their FB threads the other day. They are shutting down debate all over the shop.

The law of unintended consequences, perhaps? It's all been done with the best of intentions, but they didn't think it through.

I'd believe that if they didn't ensure that transitioning didn't affect inherited family titles. They thought that through.

It’s because people really do believe in woman brain. Sexism basically.

"'d believe that if they didn't ensure that transitioning didn't affect inherited family titles. They thought that through."
Quite.

I think it's because most men can't think of anything worse than wanting to be a woman. And that they get virtue points by repeating TWAW without any impact on them and without thinking (and/or caring) about the consequences on actual biological women.

But they don't truly believe that TWAW - they know they're really men. And that's why they're listening to them rather than us.

It's virtue signalling. They are ignorant about what's really happening, and they don't mind throwing women under the bus as a side issue. They don't really care what women think

Oh and we are in an anti-science, post-truth, individualistic, appearance-more-important-than-reality era

R0wan

Thanks for linking that thread

At the risk of saying something silly here- as I am new to the detail of all this-
I think that all the acronyms and language that has become specific to this situation isn’t helpful for people looking at these forums for the first time. I’m still not sure I understand what peak trans means- I think I’ve worked out it means the point at where you got the fact that all trans men a. Dont look at women with a women’s gaze. B. Want to be let into private women’s spaces while retaining their penises and still being attracted to women. If you come across this issue like I did it would be good to glance over threads in plain English - which I know makes typing a bit longer but it means that people can quickly pick up the gist of the arguement against self Identification.
I think the linguistics close the content off to people who have never come accross this- perhaps we should also be trying to open this all up to help make the knowledge accessible.

Good points @carrotsandcauliflower

There is a danger that people can be put off by terms and the appearance of cliqueyness.

It's blimmin' hard work to communicate ideas at the best of times. It's even more difficult when the Establishment - all political parties, councils, quangos, government departments, criminal justice system, businesses, and organisations like the Girl Guides - have been groomed to accept transgender rights, without question.

People like me don't know where to begin. There is no single Group that represents me, although there are small groups dotted around the place that HELP me find the words.

Can you help me find better words? I'd snatch your hands off for better words, without acronyms or concepts like 'misogyny' or 'sexism' that always need explaining.

GIve me words that will help me to take on the world, make allies, persuade others and win the day, even though I'm a nobody.

Several reasons why organisations rollover and accept the TWAW twaddle:

Firstly, organisations don't want to offend LGB (and legitimate) T people and vocal trans-activists take advantage of this;

secondly, the likes of Stonewall etc have been working behind the scenes for years, pushing trans propaganda;

thirdly, many people have an outdated vision of who qualifies as a TW - they don't appreciate that the majority of those claiming to be TW don't have body dysphoria but are men with a sexual fetish and a fully functioning penis; and

fourthly, it is women who are affected, not men. Go figure

Cauliflower and PamAyers, totally agree regarding language and acronyms. It stopped me from understanding the debate for ages. Then after the assault on Maria Mac I spent a month reading and finally came to grips with the language and meanings (mostly).

Unfortunately the terms are already out there being used, largely introduced by the TRAs and their organisations I understand, so there's little chance of avoiding them.

I'm sure someone on here compiled a kind of glossary of terms and acronyms thread for newcomers to the debate a while back, or am I dreaming?

The whole debate is about language vs reality.