Help me manage this incident at work

[doracarrington]

NC as possibly identifying.

Today, at work, in a small group conversation, a senior manager at work referred to a group of women (not specific women in the office, not that that matters) as 'sluts'.

I am also a senior manager, at the same grade. I'm very new to the organisation (which is small).

I was open-mouthed with horror, as while, like most people I've encountered almost-under-the-radar sexism at work, this is the first time in my (liberal charity sector) bubble I've heard actual talk. A younger male colleague did the 'that's not ok' bit, but no apology was forthcoming.

So, I figure I have two choices here:

1. Raise it directly with the CEO. She is a feminist and an ally, but has also worked with this person for a long time.
2. Raise it directly with him first, and fire a warning shot.

I have to work with this person a lot, and they have the potential to be a massive block to my team's work. Having said that, this being verbalised actually says a lot to me about the tone of certain interactions I've been on the end of and witnessed.

If an 'oh my god, I'm sorry, I don't know what came over me' had been forthcoming I might feel more generous.

Wise mumsnetters, what would you do? DH thinks I should refer directly upwards as is at least a verbal warning offence. We don't have HR; we're too small.

If he had made a racist remark you probably (hopefully) wouldn’t hesitate so I would apply the same zero tolerance to comments about women.
Personally I would put it in writing (a very formal email) to him first to give him the chance to respond but more importantly to capture in writing what happened and what was said. Then you can cc or forward to HR and/or senior management if need be.
However more knowledgeable people will be along shortly to advise.

Sorry, I see you don’t have HR. Then just senior management.

I'm shocked that you're a senior manager and resorting to a talk forum to ask for help.

Your junior colleague outright challenged it but you're asking a talkboard waht to do?

Do your job and report him.

Did you hear this ? If so - why didn't you say something then ?

Hmmm, tricky. Personally I'd be inclined to speak to him directly first. Pull him aside for a quiet word and ask him if he regularly describes women as 'sluts'? Use the fact that you're new and say how shocked you were to hear someone use that word, and ask is it just him or is it indicative of the organisational culture?

From what you've said, chances are he'll pull the old 'it was only a joke' nonsense. Then you can fire the warning shot...

I think going straight to HR, especially if you didn't say anything at the time, looks a bit cowardly and is almost certain to create bad tension between you & him - and you do need to work together. Speaking to him directly first is more honest and provides an opportunity for it to be nipped in the bud.

He sounds like a total dick. However, (and people will probs flame me for saying this) you have weigh the potential effect this may have on your job against the benefit of putting one of many sucks in their place. He may just get a slap on the wrist but your daily worklife may be seriously affected. Although the fact you have to work with him makes his behaviour something you don't want to have to keep putting up with.

Oh sorry - you were open mouthed with horror !

So how did you get your Senior management position if you can't deal with this ?

Perhaps I wasn't clear- you'll see I said 'first'- it is definitely my intention to report it; the question was about whether to have the discussion with him before I do so, which bzzbeebzz offered advice on.

You're absolutely right about zero tolerance, I quite agree.

'Dicks' not 'sucks'! A most unfortunately predictive error!

Why did you not support your junior colleague? There are so many posts on here bemoaing that decent men don't speak up- here one did and you, as a senior manager failed to support him but tacitly have now approved the sexist behaviour.

You have probably lost the momentum now on this particular incident.

I did say something then after I recovered my equilibrium slightly. I told him it really wasn't ok. And then went into a meeting, and by the time I came out he had left for the day.

I need to decide what to do with it tomorrow. It's a very small organisation without the supportive structures in terms of HR, grievance, etc I've been used to working with.

Thanks to all those who have given nuanced advice rather than telling me I'm an idiot.

You should have challenged him directly at the time. As your junior colleague did.

Your option 2) reads like giving him an opportunity to wriggle off the hook.

You witnessed it. You report it.

I also, incidentally, called the junior colleague this evening and spoke with him about it.

OK, I give up now.

I wouldn’t tackle him directly. I would raise it straight with senior management. In a ‘i new here and I’m pretty shocked to hear this and really hope it is not the norm’ way. Anything you raise with him directly has the potential to backfire on you and turn into ‘he said, she said’. Much better going the more official route. Especially if the CEO is likely to be supportive.

No one has called you an idiot.

I did say something then after I recovered my equilibrium slightly. I told him it really wasn't ok. And then went into a meeting, and by the time I came out he had left for the day

Drip feed- that is not what you said in your opening post- you made no mention of saying anything.

Nobody called you an idiot. You failed to take the opportunity of supporting a junior colleague. That was poor management.

So I have experience of something very similar to this, also very new to the company at the time.

I called the person out.

As a senior person, I felt I had a duty.
As a feminist I was fucking furious and wanted to actually make my expectations very clear as a female senior manager (in what was at the time, a very male dominated management team and culture).

I took 24 hours to calm down and actually drafted an email of what I wanted to send to the person to ensure it was documented and not misunderstood.

Prior to sending I also spoke to the MD and told him I would handle it (explained the situation, my email wording and my expectations) and told him I expected his full support in this matter.

I think he was both supportive and proud of the fact I took it off his “to do list” (we both reported to MD) & that I would deal and tackle “awkward” situations head on (It actually give me brownie points with the boss at the time - that sounds like I’m boasting but we’ve since discussed this)

The person in question didn’t know what had hit him when I sent the email. It was calm, factual and clearly set out my expectations of a senior manager as a peer and as a leader in our business. He called within minutes and apologised.

Good luck ☺️

I just hope the junior male colleague isn't now put off from challenging this type of behaviour in the future (or that he faces repercussions from the offender who might be emboldened thinking he's 'got away with it').

I'd tell him tbh. I'd just tell him that you have to report upwards as if this is already 100%, that's it's so intolerable, esp in front of junior colleagues but that you are giving him a heads up first.

Lass I too would like to know what was said before the equilibrium was lost

DrCorday- that's really good advice, thanks.

That's great advice from DrCorday. Do that!

I'm "open mouthed with horror" that you didn't speak up when your junior colleague spoke up

I totally disagree that an email is appropriate. You need to TALK to him.

I don't think an email is appropriate either. I think you should speak to him. Explain you agree with junior colleague that the language used is not acceptable.