DM: Women avoiding new gender neutral toilets in the home office because men can't close the door

[miri1985]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6065075/Female-Home-Office-employees-refusing-use-new-36-000-gender-neutral-toilets.html

Great job wasting money as usual!

thanks for the link to the other thread

I accidentally posted there to say thanks, oops.

I would like to know what they thought they were achieving but I presume the answer is just that they believe in intimidation for their "cause".

Barracker me neither

Apart from "because they were twats"? I can't think of any motivation whatsoever!

But...we believe intimidating menstruating women who may or may not be allies is justifiable and will help our cause because ..."

I still don't get it.

Making women show their dirty sanitary towel or tampon is a way to humiliate and bully them. It shows that the men have control of this shared space.

Could it have been an environmentalist group gone bonkers ?

Like

"show me what product you are using ? This came packaged in fish murdering plastic !"

"You've barely even bled on it and you are chucking rather than using it as medium to raise seedlings ! A tree died for that pad !!"

" Why aren't you using a one of those cups things you shove up your jacksie ? Do you hate voles ? Do You ? DO YOU !"

I got properly shitty about this a few years ago on AIBU. No problem helping the environment. But there seemed to be a disproportionate amount of smarmy smuggyknickered shaming aimed at exactly the sorts of products that allowed women to free themselves from being damn near chained to the home. Female sanitary products, disposable nappies, dishwashers, washing machine, hoovers. These seemed to be the first products of choice to want to eradicate for quite a few people.

Yes they all have a cost to the environment. But go eradicate all the Boys Toys and other "not actually very helpful, or useful, or fun" assorted plastic, energy hogging crap first.

Then, and only then, you can come and get snotty with me cos this vagina is too old to learn new tricks and does not want an upside down rubber wineglass shoved up it.

Thank god the menopause is well under way. At least soon I will have an ecologically acceptable foof again.

Then, and only then, you can come and get snotty with me cos this vagina is too old to learn new tricks and does not want an upside down rubber wineglass shoved up it.

😂😂😂 and, er, 🍷(sorry, didn’t know how to rotate it. But it does have some red stuff in it!)

"I got properly shitty about this a few years ago on AIBU. No problem helping the environment. But there seemed to be a disproportionate amount of smarmy smuggyknickered shaming aimed at exactly the sorts of products that allowed women to free themselves from being damn near chained to the home. Female sanitary products, disposable nappies, dishwashers, washing machine, hoovers. These seemed to be the first products of choice to want to eradicate for quite a few people.

Yes they all have a cost to the environment. But go eradicate all the Boys Toys and other "not actually very helpful, or useful, or fun" assorted plastic, energy hogging crap first. "

This! I always notice this as well.

It's cos women are to blame for everyhing innit.
Also we should be prepared to work harder to achieve whatever it is (not something that happens so much the other way around)

Ah name your right way up wineglass let the penny drop.

I kept seeing pictures with the cup thing rim down.

Only just occurred to me you turn it wine glass side up to use it.

Still not doing it. But happy that the poky bit doesn't go where I thought it went.

Tampax and I started this journey together. We have been through thick, thin, and rocky post partum patch. We'll walk my vagina to her autumn years, together to the end.

EXACTLY The eco warriors always seem to target womens stuff first.

Then there are all the Lady Bountifuls who post on period poverty threads suggesting how a young girl should be given a mooncup to use.

Womens bodily autonomy seems to fly out the window when it comes to poorer women/girls and their periods.

It's cos women are to blame for everyhing innit

I think it is worse than that.

I got so cross on the AIBU that I went off to find where this was bubbling up from. Found a really good pdf, Woodcock and ... something. Talked about Green Virtue, Green Purity, a sort of Ecological puritanical "there's a speck in your eye! A SPECK !" revival of human failings old.

Did more digging, and came across a fair few forums, that seemed to contain far too many men banging on about tampax and nappies as a first port of call. I got a strong whiff from them, of a desire to go back to a time were men where men, talking important stuff, and women were mostly confined to the home..

Which is where their wives (based on the blokes' and the wives' own description) seemed to spend most their existence. Like a step back in time, but not in the usual "fundie Christian" way I was more aware of.

Their way a woman could be Greened back 70 years. And her purity (eco-wise) was under constant control and criticism. The other women would join in to beat each other up (with a cosh of smug) over who Art Greener Than Thou. While the blokes drove off to go play with teepees.

I reckon that's where it has bubbled up from.

It was a sharply focused lesson that as much as things change, they also stay the same. New tools get invented to do ancient jobs. Sometimes with a lime coloured paint job as a disguise.

Then there are all the Lady Bountifuls who post on period poverty threads suggesting how a young girl should be given a mooncup to use

YY. Frugal people don't always have a real understanding of grinding poverty, of the sort when even on a sunny day, the world is a cold, grey, hungry place.

When I was homeless and squating the thought of spending a significant chunk of cash on something I might not be able to get up there, keep clean, rely on or just be able to forget I was on my period (From the first day, the feeling of bleeding drove me bonkers) was unthinkable. Even if I had had the sort lockable facilities that would make a more extended sort of sanitary protection change safe. I needed my knickers down for as short a period of time as possible. In, out, shove the new one, knickers up and breath again. Made it without interruption from unstable people. Halleluyah

If I'd had a chunk of money to hand of that sort of size, I would have bought food. And the biggest, cheapest box of reliable tampax I could find. Reliable, known products let me keep my job, cos I could keep reasonably clean, even when reduced to daily ablutions in public toilets.

I was in no position to start experimenting with expensive, fiddly and potential unusable new fangled things.

I do actually use a menstrual cup but it’s taken me a full year to get to grips with inserting the fucker, and I only persevered because the sheer volume of perimenopausal flooding and monstrous clots means that tampons are no longer an option for me. And it’s a bloody faff changing it if you’re not at home (haven’t yet had the joy of doing so in a gender neutral toilet). Plus I have to wait until DH is out of the house to sterilise the thing as, well, one likes to retain a bit of mystique. It’s certainly not a solution for everyone, never mind for teenagers.

I mean I love my cheap knock off mooncup but that's not really the point. This is one area where choice really is key.

But dishwashers are actually more environmentally friendly and use less water than washing by hand.

The women don't want to go in there because men do.
I concur, the likely result will be women not using those toilets and going elsewhere, without the progressiveness to interfere with female bodily functions/dignity. The (female) employee retention won't be an issue, they won't care, instead later claim "but women choose not to work here". Once again, misogynist policies get turned around and blame women, instead of being recognised as misogynist policies.

Laws like the GRA that eliminate the right of 33million females to legal recognition as a class and rights of their own to benefit say 3000 men have an MVR of 11,000:1
I like the new MVR Barracker, perfectly illustrates the situation for what it is. That women are so devalued, their wishes are not even on the radar.

Yes the MVR is perfect.

despite all the cuts to hospitals and the care providers the Government can still find money to fund this.

They replaced the toilets in a seaside town I know. They now have two rows of cubicles, back to back, about six in each row, where previously they had male and female traditional public loos. Each cubicle is completely private, and self contained. All fine, except, one row of cubicles are all urinals, the other side are gender neutral. I was fuming about it. As anybody (female) could have predicted, never a queue, or even more than half in use on urinal side, massive queue other side. Also, women have access to half the facilities men do. No woman would have ever designed or even approved this, I bet no women was even consulted on these changes.

Am dropping by just to say that the purpose-designed, single-stall, totally foolproof gender-neutral loos in Camden Market, popular with teenage girls, usually have some bloke in them with the door wide open. Dirty feckers.

Sarah Vine has played whack-a-mole with this issue today. In her Mail column she eventually gets to the reasons why single sex spaces are needed, but not before throwing in a lot of 'pc gorn mad' and implicitly blaming feminism for all the world's problems, accompanied by inaccuracies and claims that straight white people are suffering terribly from not bring able to do anything they want.

namechanged18
I ended up getting a Mirena five years ago. I wasn’t happy about it and I would have liked another option but my periode were so bad that I was constructibg my own pads and would routinely put a bin liner on everything I wanted to sit on. The day I spent sitting in the bathtub hosting myself down was the final straw. I felt I was too young for a hysterectomy. Now I still have ‘periods’ but a panty liner will take me through the day.

Constructing and hosing obviously. Why is there no edit functionality?

Seriously, you all think these guys were just being concerned about the environment and not bullying these women?

No, the conversation veered

Seriously, you all think these guys were just being concerned about the environment and not bullying these women?

No.

I think we were largely agreeing that in some quarters concern about the environment has been fashioned into a tool to allow the so inclined to bully women.

Urghh. I was at a seaside town recently with mixed toilets, the amount of women complaining that their kids could see the men peeing in the urinals.

It made me recoil and I'm fairly broad minded, there was no door, they were positioned at the far end, but if you needed the loos further down, chances are, you'll see the blokes peeing.

Really badly thought out.