Sexual assault and violence

[TheBatPig]

I have seen some respondents to feminism threads tonight (one zapped) who were victims of sexual violence or assault and felt they had not got support in the feminism topic. I think they should get advice/support etc. Their reason for not starting a thread was due to it being identifying etc. I get that. And think maybe we could just have a general thread to discuss this issue and provide support to those who need it. Or references and signposting to organisations and charities who can provide support in real life

Why not have specific support threads for DV, workplace discrimination etc

Because they wouldn't be answered. The existing "feminist support" thread has almost no traffic. Or are you suggesting they should be a standalone forum , not under the feminist umbrella?

tomorrowsword, women who post about personal experiences of rape or violence in FWR will always get support from me.

Despite your feelings about the recent nature of FWR, I've been here for years, and seen many threads about rape - although they are admittedly usually about general legalities or cases in the media.

Relationships section is a good place to go, if you don't want to continue on here. It's very supportive there, on the whole. Unfortunately, as with all MN sections, there is always the risk of trolls. (Men) People do troll us, because we're on a website with a strong feminist ethos, and it seems some people (men) cannot stand for that.

What has been said to you by the police is appalling, and as I understand it, not within the current law. You were unable to consent - an inability to "say No" because you are incapacitated through sleep or whatever, does not mean a yes.

Please don't ask for them to be deleted! Please, I think you go where traffic is. Otherwise it gets buried. If someone doesn't think it's appropriate, they can report. I think in real terms, people need support. I think a lot of working class women for eg can be put off by all the theory etc. They still need support. I think its an own goal to say this section should only be about theory and activism. Not all are in a position to do that. We need a place in think, to discuss ideas and advice without judgement

As a working class woman (apologies for starting a sentence with the wanky 'As a..' phrase) I don't think theory puts us off - I think tomorrowsworld is making a fair plea to have a thread about applying theory to a real life issue that obvious affects a huge number of women.

I think that is fair enough. It is possible to get so rarified in discussion that you lose the impact of the facts on the ground.

Don't misrepresent me tomorrowsworld I was in the conversation about identifying the best place for different types of support, both in terms of the wider misogynistic issues and the immediate need for support for someone who has experienced a sexual assualt. Just as Batpig did. And I'm definitely not the sole gatekeeper of what's a 'safe space'.

Otherwise, many of us would have left this topic, given that others have told us what they think is suitable for discussion on this topic.

So really? One poster says something and you say since pombear made it clear this wasn't a safe or appropriate space for the discussion of institutional misgoyny you have to delete?

Blimey. There are a lot of other posters on this topic area who I could infer made this space unsafe for discussing lots of things, so I'd have to delete too.

And you're misrepresenting. I've flagged this space is the space for discussion about instituional misogyny, but not for individual support for sexual violence. Not because I disagree with the need for individual support, but FWR is not necessarily the right place for it. Just as I'd question whether AIBU is the right place for relationship support.

Whilst Batpig may disagree with me, their original OP stated references and signposting to organisations and charities who can provide support in real life

If a woman is beaten, the immediate 'landing page' for support may not be a thread about the patriarchal systems that excuse violence against women.

This mirrors the same conversation that was started on an earlier thread. That was deleted. For reasons that I do not know.

Yep, you're right. I don't police these threads. Neither do you.

You have absolutely no idea of the other women who post here and their experiences of crime against women.

I don't know you, and your experiences. You don't know me, and my experiences.

But go off at me.

Your earlier posts in our discussion are now on a deleted thread, so previous context is unaccessible.

I'm tired. We obviously are looking at the rationale and need for a FWR thread separate from other support topics on this website from entirely different perspectives.

I wish you well.

I did see the other thread, its been mischaracterized, and I dont think your attacks on Pombear are acceptable.

Yes pombear,I did think I had made that clear. Perhaps not. To me this is not the first place I would post in such an instance. Does not mean other's won't. Clearly they do or this would never have come up on the other thread.

But it did, and it's not right to say post in relationship topic...they may not have had one with the person. Also I do have to say l did not come to feminism until I got free of my abusive relationship. This is the case for many women I know. You can say its not the right place for it, but unless you object to other support threads here then how can you defend your stance? And even if you can, why would you. Its a bloody forum, and I like to think that anything that encourages a woman to think and act for herself is nothing but a positive especially if she has been held back in someway

tomorrows I am, and a praciticed one that, so techniques against me like that last statement of yours is why that sentence just slicks of my back, like a duck.

No rise.

No problem.

Just leaving your statement there.

Anyone is free to advance search me to know how I feel about women and girls rights, in all the areas, sexual violence, spaces, places, and political rights

You have no idea who I am in real life, what I do for women, and people in general, those who've experienced sexual violence, or any other violence.

Maybe I am a feminist.

Maybe I'm not.

Maybe I'm Theresa May. Your internet attacks aren't hurtful, but they are interesting in what they say about you.

''I have seen some respondents to feminism threads tonight (one zapped) who were victims of sexual violence or assault and felt they had not got support in the feminism topic''

I dont think thats a fair summary.
The statement was that they did not want to start their own thread, felt there were too many threads about trans activism, and none where they could talk about their experience.

A few people were talking about how Feminism Chat isn't a safe space, its always been a target for trolls, and people talking about rape have been answered with rape jokes.
Whereas other support threads don't seem to get targeted in the same way.
Its not fair to have a go at Pombear like this.

tomorrowsword, women who post about personal experiences of rape or violence in FWR will always get support from me.

Me too.

I've flagged this space is the space for discussion about instituional misogyny, but not for individual support for sexual violence. Not because I disagree with the need for individual support, but FWR is not necessarily the right place for it

I can't believe you had the arrogance to post that.

tomorrowsword is looking for support on a legal issue and the police handling of her situation. I don't do criminal law and I have never experienced sexual assault or violence but from what she has posted from what I have gathered the police are mishandling it but perhaps someone with more experience can comment.

I don't think I have had a go at pom bear to be fair. I remember one or two posters on that particular thread say they had in fact posted and not got much support or help. I then went on to acknowledge that it is hard to start a thread if you are worried about being identified(as another poster said). I started this thread as a means to hopefully counteract the perceived apathy and look how that went? Its fucking ridiculous with the topic police. I wouldn't dream of going onto a thread to say yeah its valid but go elsewhere. Even if I thought as much. You can just ignore. I dont have any time for safe spaces, so not sure what you mean there. I just think if you disagree with something so strongly just on the basis of where it appears on a screen is quite frankly ridiculous

I didn’t see the original thread. I see no reason for it not to be here (I do see both arguments) as it is one of the most likely places that people would look for such a thread on MN. Maybe I’m missing something.

tomorrowsworld I’m here to listen at the very least.

And actually pombear, I did also say to discuss the issue (ie sexual assault and violence) in general.

I didn't see the original thread so I'm trying to piece together what was said but comments such as
If a woman is beaten, the immediate 'landing page' for support may not be a thread about the patriarchal systems that excuse violence against women
or
I've flagged this space is the space for discussion about instituional misogyny, but not for individual support for sexual violence
in response to a poster asking for help are astonishing.

If only the original thread was here for context. But no, it's not. It's been deleted.

So head off on a personal attack against me. I'm just one poster, if you want to smear me, go ahead. I was attempting to identify the most supportive areas for immediate support so they don't get lost in the FWR debate about the societal effect of attacks on women's rights. As per original thread. I apologise if this was the thread that was meant to address the poster's needs - I read it as a questioning thread about what needed to be in place.

But go off on me.