GRA consultation is live. Let's get reading

[Anlaf]

www.gov.uk/government/consultations/reform-of-the-gender-recognition-act-2004

Has Paris Lees been given a free pass on the News Channel?

BBCprotransbias

beldaran
In the terminology section of the consultation document gender is defined:
Gender: Often expressed in terms of masculinity and femininity, gender refers to socially constructed characteristics, and is often assumed from the sex people are registered as at birth.

But then with regard to the Gender Recognition Act 2004:
Following legal recognition, an individual is entitled to a new birth certificate issued in the acquired gender and in law the person’s gender becomes the acquired gender for all purposes.

So in a consultation where the meanings of 'sex' and 'gender' are so important, they conflate the two, and use both terms somewhat randomly.

You are right beldaran

The easy read document says something very different to the much clearer main document.

Easy Read: When we are born, our parents say that we are either male or female. This is recorded on our birth certificate...Most people will be quite happy with being the gender that was written down when they were born.

Main document: Sex: Assigned by medical practitioners at birth based on physical characteristics. Sex can be either male or female.
Gender: Often expressed in terms of masculinity and femininity, gender refers to socially constructed characteristics, and is often assumed from the sex people are registered as at birth

I would recommend that discussions of possible responses take place somewhere other than here. You don't show your strategy to people who might use it against you. I guarantee that TRAs will use closed groups to discuss response strategies.

I’ve not looked yet but the bits above are worrying. If the consultation starts with the assumption that gender and sex are interchangeable then what basis do we have to start from? It’s wrong to begin with.

Right! Time to get to work.

Janie143 Oh my oh my that easy read document is shocking . Noones gender is written on their birth certificate Their observed sex is. It is almost as if the word sex is too explicit to include

In yet further down the Easy Read document it gives a definition of gender dysphoria where sex is mentioned.

"Gender dysphoria is a medical condition where someone feels
that their gender is not the same as their sex."

Sorry cross post Crone as am going in and out of signal.

The main document glossary is fairly clear, at least by the standards of these things.

So in a consultation where the meanings of 'sex' and 'gender' are so important, they conflate the two, and use both terms somewhat randomly.
Exactly. You could almost think that it is like that on purpose. So it is impossible to draw any meaningful conclusions or maintain SEX segregation when SEX is the same as gender ( I'm not to prudish to shout sex so everyone can hear)

What I might do this weekend is do a page-by-page takedown of the inaccuracies people are reporting on here.

I can't this evening because I don't have the mental runtime left.

Both these documents need pulling and rewriting properly. How can the people who are supposed to Govern allow the publication such inaccurate codswallop for such an important issue

Thanks Oldcrone and Anlaf, it was one of those questions that looks so stupid written down but at the same time needed clarification even if to just point out the stupidity of it.

If the Government can't get the terminology correct and conflate the two at random, is this consultation even going to be worth the paper it's written on ( I will still be responding!).

It would be interesting to know who assisted with the creation of these documents (cynical person talking).

206 mentions of sex in the main doc vs 580 mentions on gender (and in most of those cases, they actually mean sex)

When we are born, our parents say that we are either male or female.

So as well as those mean doctors and midwives deciding your sex for you parents are also in the firing line for deciding it too.

The insinuation here is that the only way to know what sex you are is based on what adults say.

Absolutely nothing to do with biological observation and reality based on a millennia of scientific understanding that we are a dimorphic species.

bd67th agree it's worth bearing in mind that some people reading this will probably be screenshotting not agree with us.

OTOH many of the lurkers on here will not be in closed groups, and to a great extent I think this should be an open debate- we are talking about a potentially very material change to the law.

A number of groups will probably post their thoughts on the document and key points to think about, in due course.

If you could pull together the inaccuracies THAT WOULD BE AMAZING

@bd67th - you’re amazing and that would be very important work. Thank you. If you get a document out of it, happy to host it on LAWS too if you want (we accept guest posts etc).

Yes, Anlaf maybe lets start referring to line numbers and /or paragraphs so bd67th can collate it all more easily.

Not looked at it yet, but already there's sex being 'assigned'. No it is not, not in the vast majority of cases. It is observed, as we all know. Nor is this usually done by a 'medical practitioner', at least not in the UK. It's usually done by a midwife, who is not a medical practitioner. Those are doctors. So not feeling very hopeful about the drafting of this document.

Yes yes, we shall be very diligent with page numbers and paras and which doc were looking at (bd67th I am sure we can lend you a hand if you find yourself cursing us on Sunday afternoon)

"Easy-Read-Online Limited is the leading company creating easy read documents which are great for people with learning disabilities." So not actually written by the government then? Do you think the government even bothered to proof read it and check it for sense?

Do you think the government even bothered to proof read it and check it for sense?

Or indeed compatibility with the Samaritans' guidance on handling information regarding suicide

SEX SEX SEX

(Needed to get that out of my system. Sorry)

Yes, before we engage with the substance of the consultation, including an image of a child self harming is

(GRA Easy Read consultation, image on page 5)

This is para 139:

^ Non-binary genders are not recognised in UK law. Under the law of the United
Kingdom, individuals are considered by the state to be of the sex that is
registered on their birth certificate, either male or female. There exists no piece of UK-wide legislation that contemplates the existence of another gender. Furthermore, there is a raft of laws that are explicitly gendered or provide differently depending on a person’s sex/gender. Some examples of this include: legislation relating to marriage and civil partnerships; legislation relating to pregnancy; and legislation relating to maternity rights and benefits.^

Can anyone find a more egregious example of conflation sex and gender?