Trans murder rates

[dietofstrangeplaces]

I've seen the claims about trans people being murdered at very high rates. And I've seen the reply that these are actually specific murder rates, of prostitutes in particular Latin American countries.

Can anyone point me at more data about this?

I will say which none of you seen to want to acknowledge when they is competing need That's cos we are all tired of trying to have a discussion that results in us being labelled TERF and having all of those nasty Tweet threats.

As you say, that one sentence is the root cause of the current 'war' - one that is continuing to rage because women persist in demanding that the discussion happens without the heavy handed word censorship that would render the whole thing unintelligible.

How would you suggest the discussion takes place if it cannot start with the basic fact that every transwoman is male and every transman is female?

I would hope that policy is not solely based on stats but on need

How can need be established with an evidence base? Are you saying that actual evidence based policy is a mistake and should be replaced with a subjective assessment of need? How will that need be assessed? How can we protect against ‘need’ being defined by pressure groups behind closed doors? To take a medical analogy we do not treat patients based on opinion (well, we are trying our hardest to stamp it out) because it turned out, when we did research, that a lot of assumptions and beliefs about treatments were just wrong - and patients were dying (routine use of steroids in cardiac indications for example.) evidence based medicine is a much better way of treating patients.

and again I will say which none of you seen to want to acknowledge when they is competing need then there needs to be discussion and debate about how to accommodate those needs

Let’s be very clear about what happens when a want and a need collide. The need takes preference.

What you’re implying here is that women’s needs for safety should be compromised in some sort of negotiation. Many women on this board have expressed their opinion that NO is not the start of a negotiation. Women have rights to sex based protections enshrined in law and we will resist any degradation or removal of them.

When it comes to other alleged ‘need conflicts’ we get into child safeguarding as a topic. And there there is NO compromise. When it comes to child safeguarding rules, anything that will deliberately or inadvertently degrade or weaken those rules needs to be rejected out of hand.

I do hope that’s a stance you agree with? That child safeguarding is non negotiable? And that women’s rights to safety are non negotiable?

If not, it would be good if you could clarify exactly where you feel the conflicts are between women’s rights to safety/child safeguarding and the ‘needs’ you are talking about. And how you feel those needs outweigh current child safeguarding rules and the laws that protect women’s safety.

"Trans murder stats are often quoted by trans activists to prove to the world why TERFS are so horrible, as if there's a direct link between being a terf and commuting murder, when that's clearly not the case. Instead these people could be targeting male violence, against all people and perhaps helping all sex workers."

Really agreeing with this and surely this is an issue where transwomen and women do in fact have the same enemy and should be standing together.

What on earth does "standing together" mean?

It means that women should campaign against men's violence and transwomen get to police the women's campaigning so they do it in the right way.

So how Amnesty do it then?

Yes, although it's all modelled on earlier stuff, for example the fable of The Scorpion and the Frog.

Lies, damn lies, and statistics.

One murder is too many

This has been fascinating. Thank you all for contributing. I too would be very interested to know the motivation behind the murders, who the murderers were men and the stats in context - are trans sex workers more likely to be attacked than other sex workers etc. These things only work in context.

one murder is too many

And since it is VERY clear that different places have different problems stop using stats from elsewhere to make a point here!

One murder is too many

Do you like my anti screenshot system? I do believe it but find it extraordinary that it needs stating. Still, since we are annoyed at the lack of condemnation for the bomb threat it does make sense.

I mean they should stand with us instead of 'we all face misogyny unless you're an evil TERF' shit.