Misgendering is 'illegal' and boys who ID as girls can now share bedrooms with girls on school trips

[AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth]

As if the Girl Guiding farce wasn't enough....

"Children as young as four are being asked by their 'trans-friendly' primary school to inform on anyone calling transgender pupils by the 'wrong' pronoun.

The policy at Arbury Primary in Cambridge states that it is 'illegal' to call someone 'he/she' or 'it' against their wishes."

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5748821/Children-young-4-told-head-teacher-tell-pupils-misgender-classmates.html

In same article....

"Male pupils at some Welsh schools who believe they are girls will be allowed to share dormitories with female students during trips away.

The diktat has been issued by the local authority for the Vale of Glamorgan as part of new guidance for secondary and primary schools.

In a ‘Transgender Inclusion Toolkit’, launched last month, schools are advised: ‘As far as possible, trans pupils and students should be able to sleep in dorms appropriate to their gender identity.’

Bob Penrose, the Vale of Glamorgan Council cabinet member for learning and culture, said: ‘The guidance is appropriate and practical, but it is only guidance. How schools seek to use it is a matter for head teachers and governing bodies who will be free to use other resources as they see fit.’

Let me guess mad the girls would never be able to wear tiaras

Sounds like he's just having his entitled behaviour indulged and the kid needs someone to actually say no to him .

He's bloody laughing he's found a way in to do wtf he likes

A male pupil said "Its fair enough, but they're not actually boys are they." He was immediately given a C3 lunchtime detention

My child would not serve that detention.

My dd has a place at an all girls school for secondary. I feel grateful that this is something we are not going to have to deal with. We've had the "can girls be boys/can boys be girls" discussion, she's fairly about the whole thing. So far it's not really reared it's head at her primary either; inner city London primary. I do find myself wondering how much of this nonsense seems to be more prevalent in less diverse area schools because people/staff are trying so hard to be "aware".

Isn't non binary ""neither " any way. And gender fluid when they alternate between the two?

So he is deliberatly taking the piss?

If anyone here hasn't signed the petition, please could I urge you to do so?

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/214118

Currently, without debate, organisations are being advised to opt out of sex-based exemptions in the Equality Act on the basis of a more informal self-ID of gender system, as you can see by this advice to schools.

It needs to be debated openly. People need to understand it's not "being unkind" to suggest that some places and spaces need to remain sex-segregated.

My 4 year old still uses the wrong pronouns occasionally. How on earth could I correct his English if he had these additional rules to contend with.

Well exactly, mine too (and they go to an international school, so half the kids are still learning English anyhow!)

On his "girl" days, he's allowed to wear tiaras and capes and arrange fashion shows

This is why I loved my kids old school. On dressup days, anyone was allowed to wear tiaras and capes (and frequently did) - that's what's sensible, not this 'girl day'/'boy day' nonsense.

If anyone here hasn't signed the petition, please could I urge you to do so?

Thought this was in AIBU! Obviously you've all signed

Newsense
I totally agree n b3cause a boy wants to pay with prams or dolls shouldn't be a sign that he actually might be in the wrong body and be a girl and ditto for girls. It angers me so much that this is being drummed into children so much. I've already notice small but clear changes I my 4 year olds nursery. It's all bullshit. I do wholeheartedly believe that a tiny fraction of the population feel as though they have been born into the wrong body and feel as though they should be the opposite sex but this is the start of the brainwashing and convincing children that they want to be the opposite sex or "gender neutral" sorry its just not as common as we are being led to believe.

The guidance doesn't help...it says you can exclude then says you shouldn't.

The Equality Act 2010 says that organisations may treat people with the protected characteristic of gender reassignment differently in very particular and limited circumstances.
The key areas in which people with the protected characteristic of gender reassignment may be treated differently under the law are:
 Some competitive sport.
 The provision of separate and single sex services.
 Religious marriage services.
 Insurance contracts.
 Communal accommodation.
It is advisable for an organisation always to seek ways to enable full inclusion and only use the exceptions if no other option can be found. Under no circumstances should the allowable exceptions be treated as something an organisation should do.

I cant believe the school is accepting this behaviour? He is getting special treatment for what being alittle shit and working out how to manipulate the adults around him. All the parents should get together and confront the school. I bet if any other child had behaved in this was they would be excluded! I think this situation would result in me punching f* out his mother. Why is the school allowing violence against found girls? This is a violation of their human rights.

ALittleBitofVitriol I agree that it can be worse in HE circles but it's thankfully less everywhere and easier to disengage from it. I also started home educating for entirely different reasons but this one of the issues I'm glad isn't an issue for us yet.

I find this so frustrating - it feels both overboard ridiculous and incredibly lazy. We know the safeguarding issues and for kids particularly we can put more into place. If, many years ago, my dysphoric teen self got accommodations at a tiny Bible Belt high school which I transferred to mid-year so they didn't have much warning on, then now we should even more thought into it now from progressives who are meant to be advocating for these students.

I mean, they balanced my issues and enabled me to take part without putting me or anyone else at much risk. I changed in the girls' or in a unisex space. Yes, there were some risks I chose in doing wrestling on an otherwise all-male team as there wasn't a female option there, but they did all they could including on trips I slept separately. This...this is just telling people to shut up and suck it up and not really doing anything for anyone's well-being. It's overboard on thought and language control and so lazy in actually considering people's needs and how to better support people.

But if you're a minor (a school child) you don't yet have "the protected characteristic of gender reassignment", do you? You are still to be treated as the sex you were born with. So for schools it absolutely still should be sex-segregated and not muddied with gender?

The problem is that they are given access when starting their transition and not on obtaining a GRC.

Guidance notes:
Good Practice 4: Assume everyone selects the facilities appropriate to their gender
A trans person should be free to select the facilities (such as toilets or changing rooms) appropriate to the gender in which they present. For example, when a trans person starts to live in their acquired gender on a full-time basis they should be afforded the right to use the facilities appropriate to their acquired gender. Service providers must avoid discriminating against anyone with the protected characteristic of ‘gender reassignment’.

The lack of logic in pushing this stuff through is baffling.

We want to put things single gender
OK why are things split in the first place
Because sometimes we keep cunty people and dicky people separate for reasons of fairness, safety, privacy
But won't this mix up cunty and dicky people?
No, because the words that were shorthand for "cunty" now mean cunty or dicky, and the words that were shorthand for "dicky" now mean dicky or cunty
So why do we separate them at all any more?
Because the people who like rough and tumble are too much for the ones who like sparkles and glitter. The ones who like sparkles and glitter deserve space to be able to be quiet and do crafting and not move around too much. Maybe try each others clothes on and giggle. You know, the girls. The other ones enjoy physicality and are much more assertive, they deserve to be able to be together. You know, boys.

@Giles The girls certainly don't get to wear whatever they like.

Non binary was my word so I suppose he could be genderfluid. It has certainly come from the adults in his life as he's been like this since at least year 1.

I know of at least 1 girl that has been moved to a different school by her parents because she was constantly targeted by him.

The mother of one of dd's friends did approach the boy's mother. She seemed reasonable during the conversation saying she was working with the school to improve his behaviour. The next day, she complained to the school that she was being targetted by friend's mum because her boy is different! The school backed boy's mum up!

MsGameAndWatching I honestly don't want to worry you but I'd bet my bottom dollar that this issue will start coming up in 'girls' schools' in just the same way that the wonderful AgnesBadenPowell has described for 'Girl' Guides.

I'd urge you to ask the school for their policy.

Where do gender fluid children go?

Pips / Phil Bunce was there with GG the other day at some event at parliament, they are an example of a gender fluid person, one name and pronouns on some days, another name and pronouns on other days. In Bunce's work, they said they get very upset and have to cry in the ladies when they are misgendered. I think it is a BIG ask for the same person to expect everyone else to use different names and words depending on whether they are wearing a man suit and standing in a power stance, or wearing a frock and standing like "I'm a little teapot" as it's well known all women prefer to stand (if they don't they are probably really men).

So in this case on a school trip the child would sleep according to whether they were having a "boy" day or a "girl" day.

I cannot see how anyone sees this as logical in any way. There is literally NO point in sex segregation if this is how it works, unless you believe people need to be separated depending on whether they like standing like action man or "I'm a little teapot"... Which maybe lots of people do? To which I call sexism + homophobia.

recent Guardian article raised some of the issues with regards schools' policies:

www.theguardian.com/education/2018/may/15/transgender-row-teachers-afraid-challenge-breast-binding#comment-115844701

& thread discussing the article:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3249931-Interesting-article-discussing-transgender-support-by-schools-in-the-Guardian

There seems to be some sanity in the school as I just asked dd if he changes with the boys at swimming and he does. So that's hopeful at least.

Travis Alabanza identifies as 'non binary' which basically seems to mean he gets to wear slightly eccentric clothing (oh and change with teenage girls if he feels like it).

@MadCap

You should tell the school that the child is gender-fluid, not non-binary. Gender fluid is when you switch between genders daily. Non-binary is when you are niether gender. Get the debate rolling!

But both are complete bollocks.

Boys will sleep with girls and should anything untoward happen it's teachers who will fall on that sword as a he scapegoats.

I feel sorry for parents with school aged DCs.

& frankly it's frightening that all this is going over everyone'd head. I do not have a single real life friend who even talks about this. People don't know. I only see commentary on MN.

A small group of the monied and privileged are, as ever, getting their way. & the majority of people are so caught up in Brexit and politics and being utterly distracted by social media, that the real life issues are passing them by. Madness.

I think this article needs to be posted on the main boards. It will soon affect a lot of parents!

headmaster Ben Tull advocated his trans-friendly policy in a previous interview, saying: 'It is really important that a school is ready for anyone who walks in.

'For children at primary level, the more we can do to non-stereotype them the better. We steer away from the binary model.'

How could you get more binary than telling someone who 'feels like' the opposite gender to change their name as though they are now the opposite sex?

This is a problem on so many levels I wouldn't even know where to start.

There is undeniably a huge element of social contagion with this stuff and I don't think it's appropriate for four-year-olds to have to consider it.

Telling small children that accidentally calling someone he/she instead of she/he is illegal is fucking disgusting. That will strike terrible fear into a small child.

Both of the above: multiply by one hundred for autistic children.

Agree that this needs to go on a main board.

Did you see the bit about the YHA at the bottom of the daily fail article? Guess I'll never stay in a group YHA room again, shame as they're affordable tbh it's not transwoman I'm worried about it's opportunistic nasty men. Even if there was no sexual assault risk I'd still feel very stripped of my dignity.

sorry purrrrrfect went to park with kids. no i haven't complained. i was thinking of asking for policy on all this at the parent's evening next week. will take some literature to counter likely mermaids lesson plans.