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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why do men think they can get away with this!!!!

76 replies

stripesandspots10 · 16/05/2018 08:43

I'm so angry. Why do men believe they can spike women's drinks with extra alcohol to get them very drunk just because they want to take advantage of them. I've had this happen to me twice and it happened to my sister last night. All being men we knew and men we thought were friends.
They obviously only thought they had some kind of chance with us if they were to ply us with extra alcohol.
The first time this happened to me I noticed as I weren't really tipsy so I left the drinks. Second time I had already had a few drinks so did not notice that the guy had started buying doubles. My sister last night asked for a single and told my DM this morning she has a feeling they might have been doubles. Then he tried it on with her and because she rejected him, he is saying it was both of them. Argh what makes them think this is acceptable behaviour!

OP posts:
OnTheList · 16/05/2018 11:00

Because they can get away with it, its generally brtushed off (if acknowledged at all) as just being 'laddish behaviour' and still blamed on the woman who should have noticed she was getting drunk too quickly or should have had one of those testing stick things or whatever, if she did not, then its clearly her fault. Twas ever thus.

I have been spiked by drugs. I think it was royhypnol but I was never tested so cannot be sure. Luckily though, I was actually out with my partner at the time, though we were separated for an hour or so so the guy obviously thought I was alone. By the time the drugs kicked in, my partner was back and took me home. It was a very scary experience though all the same and made me realize just quite how much some men just do not give a tiny crap about what women want, or their health, or anything at all besides their knobs.

Another time I had the extra alcohol thing. I do not accept drinks from strangers, however I was with a male (ex)friend and we were taking turns getting the rounds. I think it must have been when I started getting a bit tipsy that he started topping up the alcohol. When I confronted him about it he said he had been buying triples (!) in an attempt to get me to lighten up a bit as I seemed down. Yeah, nothing to do with him trying it on at the end of the night eh?! Again, luckily I was kind of in control of myself, as I had noticed myself getting a lot drunker a lot faster and had moved onto just cokes, at which stage he said he would walk me home..probably because he realized that this was the only chance he would get as not drinking anymore alcohol would mean I start getting more sober, not drunker as was the plan. I have never since let anyone buy drinks for me, except for my parents/siblings and my (now) husband. Its too risky. But yeah, there are many other ways to be caught out by these pervs and its never the victims fault that someone treats them in this way, regardless of what they do/don't do.

OnTheList · 16/05/2018 11:04

Actually, when I was about 19 I was spiked in a club too. With ecstasy. However, I took ecstasy recreationally at the time so I knew what it was, (and honestly it made my night a bit better, though its not really something to joke about at all) I was glad it had been me rather than someone else, as I could take it due to having experience with the drug, it would be scary as fuck for someone who had never taken it. Was a waste of their attempt to drug and rape a woman. Of that I am glad, at least.

DisturblinglyOrangeScrambleEgg · 16/05/2018 11:35

Because they can. The doubles instead of singles, topping up drinks when you're distracted so you don't know how much you've had etc.

I had to teach DP some of my tricks when he had a weird boss who delighted in getting his employees drunk (so he could then hold it against them later - although female employees had that plus the extra risk). Stuff like getting a bottle of water and topping up your drink so you can skip a round, abandoning drinks half drunk, buying plain tonic water for yourself when its your round.

It's insane that I have a whole host of strategies to deal with people trying to get me drunk, but I had to have them, it happened all the time.

InfiniteSheldon · 16/05/2018 11:49

Deeply distressing how many of us have experienced this. It's another issue with unisex toilets I've used women only toilets to escape uncomfortable situations and called a taxi and escorted a girl out from the toilets straight to said taxi despite her 'date's' protestations.

LaSqrrl · 16/05/2018 13:15

I have had my drink spiked as well, must be nearly 20 years ago. There were complete bits of memory blacked out. Luckily I did manage to get it together, panic and bolt, and avoid triple rape. Not enough reliable memory to report, or even describe what they looked like. So yes, after that, learned not to leave a drink behind when going to the loo.

PatriarchyPersonified · 16/05/2018 13:22

Its a red flag behaviour in the extreme.

Its not necessarily indicative of 'rapey' intent, (some blokes will spike each others drinks to get them to 'loosen up'/for a laugh etc) but its a massive flag that the person doing it doesn't respect personal boundaries.

In the interests of balance, I have seen women do this to each other and to men as well though 'for a laugh'.

bd67th · 16/05/2018 13:22

@waddlelikeapenguin: I am surprised people dont notice they are feeling drunker quicker etc I mean would reminding people to drink based on how they feel rather than numbers help? Disclaimer is that I have/had (i dont really drink anymore) a very very high alcohol tolerance.

For those of us who have a very low alcohol tolerance, by the time we realise that we have been poisoned with shots in pints, it's already too late to back off.

ALittleBitofVitriol · 16/05/2018 13:24

Yep I've had mine spiked too, a friend had a sip of mine and realised before I had too much of it. I was 16 and in a foreign country.
I have friends who weren't so lucky, and of course none of the rapists were so much as charged...

bd67th · 16/05/2018 13:28

@onthelist some men just do not give a tiny crap about what women want, or their health, or anything at all besides their knobs.

Especially the health bit. I'm on medication that means I must not drink as I will collapse after one pint and I am allergic to latex as well. So the rapist MO of "spike her drink and use a condom to prevent leaving DNA" will put me in hospital.

stripesandspots10 · 16/05/2018 13:32

Wow can't believe it's happened to so many of us. Makes me so angry. The first man who done this to me I thought was a friend. After this incident and others i filed a harassment claim against him at work!
What makes me angry about my sister's experience last night is he accepted no blame for trying to get her really drunk and laid blame towards her.
I accept no drinks from strangers. I remember one guy at a festival years ago offered me a drink I declined and brought my own. He was highly offended! Since the alcohol spiking for me I now accept no drinks from anyone and do not leave my drinks unattended.
It's a shame we have to do this though and men feel like this is ok to do this because then it's our faults for being "too drunk" when in actual fact they made it that way.

OP posts:
OnTheList · 16/05/2018 13:33

Yeah, I used to drink fairly quickly when I was out too, so by the time the extra hit me, I had drank several more already. I do pace myself a lot more these days, so would probably notice faster, though it still does take some time for alcohol to actually 'work' so its very possible you could have had another couple of extra shots (or 2 extra shots in my case per drink) before you even realised. Along with being a fast drinker, the fucker waited until I was already a fair bit tipsy so my judgement was not quite as it would be otherwise.

The excuse that he was trying to get me to enjoy myself, I could have bought too..if not for him trying it on on the way home. That kind of confirmed to me that it was on purpose for that reason.

UpstartCrow · 16/05/2018 13:36

What makes me angry about my sister's experience last night is he accepted no blame for trying to get her really drunk and laid blame towards her.
DARVO is abuser behaviour - Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender.

''It want me, you made me do it, its all your fault, I'm really hurt and offended''.

OnTheList · 16/05/2018 13:45

''It want me, you made me do it, its all your fault, I'm really hurt and offended''.

This was kind of the reaction of my (ex) friend. He didn't deny it, but he said he did it as I seemed down and he was trying to help. He was so very offended that I said he did it so that I would say yes to his advances (I had previously said no multiple times) and he finally accused me of being paranoid and said I needed to 'just lighten up for fucks sake'

Waddlelikeapenguin · 16/05/2018 13:47

Thanks @bd67th
For those of us who have a very low alcohol tolerance, by the time we realise that we have been poisoned with shots in pints, it's already too late to back off

That makes sense; I think I really did have a quite freakishly high tolerance for alcohol (it took me a long time ro realise that as my best friend was a huge rugby player & I just drank along with him Confused) all my friends would say they have never seen me drunk despite drinking copiously with them.

Urrgghh so there really is nothing to be done but assume the worse of everyone & protect your drink Sad

UpstartCrow · 16/05/2018 13:54

We don't need to assume the worst of everyone, we just need to remember it only takes on bad person in the room to be a risk to everyone. They don't advertise who they are.
If it turns out its someone we know, call them out and ostracise them.

UpstartCrow · 16/05/2018 13:56

OnTheList Envy
I think it feels worse when its someone you've known for a while. Like being stabbed in the back.

bd67th · 16/05/2018 13:56

The worst thing is that we all up our defences, so the rapists change their MOs to suit.

bd67th · 16/05/2018 14:08

The worst thing is that we all up our defences, so the rapists change their MOs to suit. Ok, I meant "the icing on the cake", the insult added to the injury.

It's almost like they will do anything to get into a woman's knickers, whether she wants that or not.

OnTheList · 16/05/2018 14:28

I think it feels worse when its someone you've known for a while. Like being stabbed in the back.

Yes, it certainly affected me more when it had been someone I had known since being a toddler than when it was a stranger doing it. There was the added part of a huge breach of trust and I became deeply suspicious of other male friends too.

I suspect I was drugged at another time, by a male 'friend'. I was actually raped that time, but luckily I remember nothing of it at all besides a few random flashbacks. I say suspect, when I am almost certain that was what happened as there is no other reason I would totally lose parts of that night, I have never had memory lapses before, and the little parts I do remember were pretty violent too, so it seems that whatever happened that night, I put up a fight (not saying those who do not fight are wrong, incase thats read that way. just that in my mind there is absolutely no doubt I was raped rather than it being consensual in any way, and the fighting is part of why I think that)

CertainHalfDesertedStreets · 16/05/2018 14:37

Well the second reply on this thread makes it the problem of the person being spiked nor the person doing the spiking so that's probably one good reason why they continue to do it?

Iputthescrewinthetuna · 16/05/2018 14:51

Its wrong that we have to do this. But my poor dad -Father of 4 girls, would always tell us to drink out of bottles, if somebody wished to buy us a drink to say We couldn't decide on what to have and go to the bar with them, finish any drink before going to the ladies and keep thumb over bottle at all times.
The only time I didn't follow his advice I was spiked. However I was with a very good friend who noticed I wasn't right and he took me home immediately.

NatLuc · 16/05/2018 15:48

Something actually happened to me about three weeks ago.

I went to a gathering of people to make some friends since I have not long moved to a new city, I had one small glass of red wine which I nursed for about 2 hours as I was watching the pennies, anyway, one of the guys offered to buy me a drink after we had been talking for an hour or so, I accepted and asked for another small glass of red wine, I got stuck talking to others in the group and couldn't follow him to the bar but when I caught up with him hed bought me a large.. Which at the time I was grateful for, it was just a social mid-week gathering, nothing crazy, but even though I had only had about half of that second wine (the large one) and then went home (feeling more drunk than I should). I was in bed by 2330 (normal for me) and when I woke up the next day I felt incredibly rough.. bad wine? The thought crossed my mind but the amount was not enough to make me feel that bad.

Choosing to put it down to being tired but definitely not normal for me and I knew no one there, it was my first time with the group.

Waddlelikeapenguin · 16/05/2018 15:54

UpstartCrow
We don't need to assume the worst of everyone, we just need to remember it only takes on bad person in the room to be a risk to everyone. They don't advertise who they are.

You're right I worded it badly Flowers

bd67th · 16/05/2018 15:59

In reply to the OP: they think that they can get away with it because they often do get away with it. As that Belfast rape trial showed, rape is de facto legal, even if de jure it isn't. 80% of rapes are committed by someone the victim already knows, which reflects what PPs have said. It's threads like this that make me want to criminalise all PIV sex and/or send all men to Mars. 6% of them can't be trusted around us at all and we have no real recourse when they hurt us.

ifeelsoextraordinary · 16/05/2018 16:06

Another here who has been spiked at least twice. Once I was with a friend who was could see I was not myself and got me home safely. The next I wasn’t quite so lucky and ended up in a pretty dangerous situation. In my 20s it was just something that I accepted. In my 40s now with 2 daughters of my own I am beyond furious.

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