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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Choking women

53 replies

QuarksandLeptons · 13/05/2018 21:18

A good (rare non porn adoring) article from the Guardian questioning the popularity of choking women for sexual gratification.

The author makes the observation that it’s the perfect instrument of misogyny as it both hurts and silences women in one swoop.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/may/13/choking-women-me-too-breath-play

OP posts:
womanformallyknownaswoman · 15/05/2018 00:36

Attempted strangulation is one of the highest red flag behaviours preceding dv murder - Jackie Campbell in the USA developed a risk framework which significantly reduced DV murders and recognising attempted strangulation as a murder gateway precursor was a huge part of that

womanformallyknownaswoman · 15/05/2018 00:46

Gail Dines is a star for taking this lead role in outing porn in its different forms - I learnt from her that the average age boys are watching hard core porn is 11 now and it is skewing their behaviour and attitudes towards women - really dangerous mind control at an early age. She presents regularly on panels and I have been astonished how libfems dismiss her informed comments.

We need to get women only communities going and also teach martial arts to girls- this is endemic now

Ereshkigal · 15/05/2018 01:06

Gail Dines is amazing.

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 04:04

That link someone posted is like Stockholm syndrome - the Mumsnet thread.

Of all the BSDM things to have normalized as a society, why the one most likely to lead to death? Maybe the defenders should think about that for a while.

QuentinSummers · 15/05/2018 07:31

angry that thread is Shock
I really hope it's a sex pozzie pile on rather than an actual reflection of the world.

Ugh. Ugh. Ugh.

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 07:34

I had to close out after about the 5th page before I said something that would get me banned, Quentin. What part of "this is potentially fatal" are some people not getting?

lovetheway · 15/05/2018 07:39

Thank God for some sanity. That other thread really shook a and upset me. All that 'he likes to watch my face' and the usual cries of slut shaming, prude, vanilla.

In fact, the insults and justifications just confirmed my view - it's men with a hatred of women, and women with internalised misogyny.

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 07:41

If a man told me he liked to watch my face while I was being choked I'd run like I was Usain Bolt.

picklemepopcorn · 15/05/2018 07:50

I bailed on that thread really early. Really early. Don't think I can go back. Well done to those that tried to open people's eyes...

picklemepopcorn · 15/05/2018 08:00

Just makes me sick reading it. That so many men think that way.

AssignedPuuurfectAtBirth · 15/05/2018 08:58

AAK
That comment of looking peaceful when she passed out had me in full nee-naw mode. If this makes me vanilla, fine. I'd rather be alive. And have a partner who doesn't want to risk my life. So very dull.

FermatsTheorem · 15/05/2018 09:05

I had to close out after about the 5th page before I said something that would get me banned, Quentin. What part of "this is potentially fatal" are some people not getting?

Me too, AAK

Also the constant refusal to see a distinction between what grown adults get up to consensually and a porn culture which is pushing potentially fatal activities as "normal" and "aspirational", where teenage girls find themselves on the receiving end of choking in their first sexual encounters because some spotty teenage boy has watched hardcore porn on his smartphone from the age of 9 onwards.

(And the constant "you're just vanilla boring prudes" line. Huh, an orgasm is an orgasm is an orgasm. So long as I have them who gives a shit if someone else judges my method of achieving them to be dull? They don't feel dull. I always wonder whether, in contrast to their protestations about how boring the rest of us are, these people are in fact the ones who are under-sexed, the fuss they make about all the paraphenalia and extreme acts it requires to enable them to get off.)

Incarnationsofunderstanding · 15/05/2018 09:05

assigned that particular poster also has MH and self harm issues. But apparently totally not connected to enjoying a partner nearly killing you...

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 09:06

@ Assigned

Necrophilia just isn't something I'm looking for in a sexual partner, you know.

(needs vomiting smiley)

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 09:13

The most disturbing comment for me was the one where someone was insisting that this is just how het sex works, with women getting off on the power imbalance between them and men, and choking, caning etc are therefore just turning up to 11 something that's present anyway. To which I was going, a. if that's true then why do you think you're being subversive by doing it? and b. that is not in fact how sex works for all het couples.

LangCleg · 15/05/2018 09:19

I got as far as the he gets off on the blissful look on my face as I pass out post on that thread and couldn't go any further.

Herja · 15/05/2018 09:30

Incarnationsofunderstanding No, they're not. Arguably some of the things I like could be. That one isn't.

But you know, let's blame it on the mental health issues. Seems to work for everyone in pretty much every aspect of my life...

Incarnationsofunderstanding · 15/05/2018 09:48

Herja EVERY choice we make is interconnected, sorry but there is no way it isn't, even if it doesn't seem so on a straightforward rationale level.
I'm sorry you feel that way about your MH issues and absolutely do not intend to attack/upset you on those.

The more I look back on my horrific experience he more I realise I put myself in danger due to feeling lonely and semi depressed, it didn't seem that way at the time, I was happy to make it, but as I say life isn't so black and white.

Not that I am taking the blame, only some responsibility for being there.

There is nothing inherently wrong with people wanting to practice BDSM as a niche, but when it has become so normalised and mainstream as it has it's dangerous. I find it absolutely to blame for the torture I went through and will never back away from that.

UpstartCrow · 15/05/2018 10:01

Many of the posts on that thread are similar to the type of posts you find on threads about prostitution that are spammed by pimps.
BDSM became mainstream (and co-opted) when it became more mainstream in pornography.
Join the dots.

LaSqrrl · 15/05/2018 10:16

Also the constant refusal to see a distinction between what grown adults get up to consensually and a porn culture which is pushing potentially fatal activities as "normal" and "aspirational", where teenage girls find themselves on the receiving end of choking in their first sexual encounters because some spotty teenage boy has watched hardcore porn on his smartphone from the age of 9 onwards.

This is sadly the MO of patriarchy, Fermats. And that is where we should intervene, to stop more YW getting sucked in. The ones already there, too late to save most of them, already debated them online. 95% no hope there.

Herja · 15/05/2018 10:20

Incarnationsofunderstanding
Thank you.

UpstartCrow · 15/05/2018 10:20

In any other context this would be labelled for what it is; grooming.

womanformallyknownaswoman · 15/05/2018 10:52

UpstartCrow In any other context this would be labelled for what it is; grooming

This!! You read my mind ;)

LaSqrrl · 15/05/2018 10:59

In any other context this would be labelled for what it is; grooming.

That it is. That it is.

AngryAttackKittens · 15/05/2018 11:07

Especially the way women who're uncomfortable with the whole thing were being not only shouted down but shamed for their discomfort. "You're a prude" is basically "you better do this or else", socially speaking.