"International men's day" post

[TheBrilloPad]

A fb relative (student - university age) posted the post below re: "international men's day".

Would you comment something? Ignore it? It angered me and I can't articulate why clearly.

Meh, the patriarchy is bad for men too. That's what those stats say to me.

I do indeed hope they spend their "day" working to bring it down. That's cool with me.

There’s no way that DA stat is right for a start.

Well but if you are man who is killed by another man I don't think that makes it all okay??

I think that there are very valid points about the particular challenges that men face.

It's mostly poor (i.e. not wealthy) men who are the cannon fodder. And the interventions needed to address these issues require specific consideration.

Fair dos. I have no problem with it at all.

Some of what they claim is a flat out lie but still, positioning themselves as the victim when they are also the perp seems a bit disingenuous..
The only people men kill more often than women is men.
Male violence is the greatest human rights crisis the world has ever known.

We aknowledge IMD in our house like we do for IWD because I want equal rights for both my sons and daughters, I want to fight for causes that effect them both, I need to fight harder and more often for my daughters but that doesnt mean men dont suffer too, that doesnt mean I will ignore or excuse the injustices my sons face.

"positioning themselves as the victim when they are also the perp seems a bit disingenuous"

thats such an odd way to look at it though - the individual who gets killed is a victim and is a separate person - who may or quite possibly may not have any power in creating the system/set of circumstances which lead to the violence. Its not the tall rich white men who are CEOs who are getting killed - its mostly poor men.

So the issue is yes male violence is a major problem - but many of the victims of it are men. So what can be done to stop that. A male death is no less worse than a woman's death regardless of the fact he was killed by another man.

“So the issue is yes male violence is a major problem - but many of the victims of it are men. So what can be done to stop that. A male death is no less worse than a woman's death regardless of the fact he was killed by another man.”

Absolutely. The problem is that men often seem to use statistics about violence aagaist men to try to minimize violence against women- rather than facing up to the problem as something they should be addressing.

I think raising the awarenss of male victims/survivors of domestic violence is a good thing. yes women are more likely to be the victim.

some of the other stats do irritate a little though. depends on the intent behind the stats chosen.

“that doesnt mean I will ignore or excuse the injustices my sons face“
I think we have to be careful. Men face difficulties and challenges and are victims of crime. But do they face any collective injustice ^because they are men”? And if you think they do, who is perpetuating the injustice?

It makes me cross because its all compared to the stats for women and doesn't point out that men are also the perpetrators in the murders, violent crimes and often the dv.

Yes, it’s very hard to get men to accept that they have to do something about toxic masculinity.

Someone at a refuge told me the figures for men in domestic violence are generally inflated as when the police are called for a woman who's been attacked by her loving partner, he often says 'I was defending myself -- she hit me first' and so the police have to log his complaint as well.

Also, I know lots of women who are victims of domestic violence -- they stay to try to make it better or because they've got no money or for the kids. They get it again and again.

I knew a guy whose wife had mental health issues and one day socked him one. He left the next day.

Is it? The UK website doesn't seem that way to me- it doesn't really mention women. I've not really seen much else about it- what 'proper' things should it be focusing on?

It is a useless poster. The statistics are probably correct but fail to point out violence is almost overwhelmingly committed by men usually on men.

It is true that the group most likely to be at risk of a violent attack are young men but what needs to be addressed is why are men attacking each other? Men themselves are the cause of the problem.

On the other hand it makes no sense to lump suicide in with violence. So far as suicide there is no doubt that suicide rates are much higher for men. There are professions which are high risk and male dominated - e.g farming - solitary nature of the work and access to legal firearms but men in medicine and law have higher rates than women. That poster does nothing to even remotely suggest how to deal with this.

So the issue is yes male violence is a major problem - but many of the victims of it are men. So what can be done to stop that. A male death is no less worse than a woman's death regardless of the fact he was killed by another man

No body is saying that the death of a man is less bad but if all the violent women in the world turned over a new leaf it would make no significant dent in those statistics.

If all the violent men did the same violence would become an aberration.

Men glorify and encourage male violence and so therefore when talking about male violence there is nothing "odd" about seeing them as both perp and victim. That is what men as a class are.

My main problem with it being posted now, is that it’s so obviously a retaliatory “what about the menz” post because of the timing. How many women post about IWD in December?

Other than that, more generally I too feel it appears to be more of a retaliation against IWD than something setting out to raise awareness of men’s issues. It’s as if they have to set out to right any possible sign that women have something men don’t. We are never to be allowed equity. And even steps towards equality are grudging.

Tells about men's issues.

No mention of women whatsoever.

Just trying to raise awareness.

Somehow still an attack on women.

Maybe that feeling of being attacked comes from inside.

Maybe it's guilt.

No Individual bears responsibility for actions that are not their own, or for changing behaviour they do not themselves enact. If your actions or beliefs aren't trying to hurt men, then obviously the poster isn't about you, is it?

(the above is, obviously, a satirical derivation of feminist responses when men feel 'attacked' by feminist messages)

The 40% victims of domestic abuse is from a study where the umbrella of abuse is so broad, it includes
"Does your partner use swear words towards you" often /sometimes/ never
Type of questions.

Domestic Violence is another thing entirely resulting in men murdering hundreds of women per year.

Not that it's a competition but the poster doesn't actually mention DV.

And I the 85% homeless figure is referring to rough sleepers only. Not homeless in temporary acc or refuges and various other types.
When you include all types of homelessness the figures for women shoot up.

Men's issues should be talked about more. Men's mental health should not be taboo.

The poster was doing the rounds on IWD.
I guess your friend has only just come across it so as shared it, but didn't connect that it was circulating as on IWD to basically say
"But what abut the menz -wail"

Weird. Delete the two extra "as" in my post above!

Every day is International Men’s Day.

The issue is male violence. Men and women are the victims of male violence. There isn't anywhere near as big an issue with female violence. All the "but men are victims too..." statistics almost always ignore that the perpetrators are usually male.

I don't like these things that pit themselves against the women's equivalent for the purposes of 'making a point', rather than actually campaigning for something in their own right.

If men have an issue with aspects of the patriarchy, including male violence and attitudes towards 'weak men' including attitudes towards mental health problems then I absoutely think that they should be raising awareness and campaigning to break down these barriers. Of course they should.

But any assertion that women are in the wrong for not challenging them also; that feminism is somehow responsible for them; or any attempt to piggy back on women's legitimate campaigns for the purpose of undermining the women's campaign is simply disingenuous.