How to challenge blatant misogyny in a situation I cannot leave or disrupt for others.

[Stormwhale]

I am attending a physio exercise class at the hospital due to a back problem. There are 6 others, including one man who clearly hates women and thinks he is big and clever with his disgusting comments and behaviour.

The first day I met him, he was bragging about his friends young girlfriend. Apparently IT is fit as fuck and he asked his friend how many paper rounds IT had done. .

He makes stupid fucking comments all the time and I have to listen to his misogynistic comments for an hour and a half twice a week. He also takes every opportunity to make mocking comments towards me, such as telling me I shouldn't be in the class because I'm too flexible (I have a hypermobility syndrome, it's why I'm fucking there) and giving me suggestive looks, making comments on how I do the exercises, commenting on when I decide to have a drink, apparently I'm not allowed to have my drink until the end!?

He is an utter cunt, and he comes across as a woman hating Billy big bollocks. It's making me so angry. He also tends to follow me around the exercise circuit despite me moving away from him so I have to hear his endless drivel. He goes on about how he was staring at the hydrotherapy instructors boobs, how it was nice to be up close with her in the swimming pool and sexist comments about every woman he meets. These comments are not to me as I have just given him a cold stare and walked away when he has tried to brag to me.

Most of the others in the class are taking it seriously, and the physio staff there are fantastic. I am hesitant to make a big fuss (socialization clearly has done a number on me!) Because it feels unfair on the other patients in the class and especially the physios who are working so hard to help us.

It seems as though most of the other patients think he is funny and don't seem to have a problem with his behaviour, but I just can't stand it. I have 4 more sessions to get through. What would you do?

What a creep! I’d talk to the instructor and tell them how uncomfortable he is making you. They could have a quiet word.

I'd just tell him to fuck off - why should you put up with it?

Complain. Someone needs to make him accountable for his behaviour.

Complain, I would. Chances are that some of the others feel the same but laugh along out of discomfort or wanting to keep the peace.

I'd be inclined to repeat what he said very loudly so everyone could hear and tell him not to speak like that again as its vile and you've had enough of listening to it. Something along the lines of "please stop talking about staring at the hydro teachers boobs etc its putting me off and I am actually here to try and learn something and get better".
I'd be surprised if the others actually were okay with it and weren't just going along with it out if embarrassment.

Are the other patients women? Are you certain they find it funny? Maybe they also just feel unable to say anything.

I too would probably start by talking to one of the physios about how uncomfortable it makes you. Not sure where I’d take it if that doesn’t help because I’m not great on confrontation.

Complain to instructor.
If that means twat is asked to leave the class, tough

NotAllThat, you are properly assertive and I take my hat off to you.

There are two other women, the rest men. One of the other woman made a comment to him about how she understood why he enjoyed hydrotherapy so much after seeing the instructor, so that makes me think she is fine with it.

The other woman I'm not sure. She seems to encourage the 'banter with him. I'm the only one who does start conversations with him, and I most definitely don't laugh at his comments or jokes.

The way he acts towards me is as if I'm an awful bore because I don't hang off his every word. Then add in a side of creepy behaviour towards me and it just makes me sick.

One of the instructors is female, and she doesn't seem to like the way he speaks, but doesn't tell him to stfu either. The male instructor is very quiet and passive and I think he would struggle to stand up to this dickhead. He is a very overpowering personality and I think he will react in a defensive and insulting manner if challenged. He sees nothing wrong with his behaviour whatsoever.

One other man in the sessions seems really close with this guy and 100% goes along with his shit, laughing and doing the classic 'bro' thing. The other men laugh, but it could be because they dont know how else to react.

I think I will have a word with the female instructor next week as I feel that out of the two, she is more likely to challenge his behaviour. On the first day of the group, she came out to the waiting area to let us know one session will be postponed and after she went back into the gym he made mocking remarks about how she fancies him. I haven't seen any behaviour that would suggest that at all, he just thinks he is God's gift to women.

*Doesn't start conversations.

I have no desire to speak to this piece of shit.

you need to complain, i is not something that should be tolerated and i am surprised that the instructors have not tackled this.

i would first approach the instructors and give them a chance to sort it and tell them that if it doesn't stop you will formally complain. they should deal wth it

He sounds vile.

You’d think he’d want to hang out with the woman who encourages this shit, rather than you.

But that’s a power thing, isn’t it? Probably can’t bear the fact that you aren’t fawning over him and egging him on.

Do you need to hear instructions? If not could you pointedly take out an ipod and start listening to it when he starts talking to you?

As for the comments about women "It is not for me to tell you how to think or what you say but I find what you say really offensive"

So far as the comments about you - "why I am here is between me and my doctor"

Sounds like Michael Caine's Alfie.

Complain. First to the instructor, if you get no joy, try PALS.

Do you need to hear instructions? If not could you pointedly take out an ipod and start listening to it when he starts talking to you?

Brilliant suggestion. Have your ear phone hanging round your neck and only put them in when he starts talking to you

I told a sexist young man that he reminded me of a much older man. He instantly said 'what? what do you mean, how so' . He was in his twenties and I told him that he behaved like a man born in 1940 not 1990. BUT although I think I got to him (his cockiness did visibly deflate) he certainly did NOT become a nicer person. When a man with a small ego hates you, he doesn't become pleasant.
It's so hard.
If you report it you're told you're over reacting, you need to learn how to forgive and overlook and ignore. Cos a young man can never be stopped in his stride.

Thank you for your replies. In one way it's good to have people just say that his behaviour is unacceptable. I actually told my therapist about it today, and although she agreed it was sexist, she didn't think I should be that bothered. I feel differently.

I haven't got a session until next Friday as the one earlier in the week is the cancelled one. I am going to have a word with the female physio and see how it goes.

Unfortunately I do need to hear what the physios are saying. One of the best things about the class is that they watch you do the exercises and talk to you to let you know of adjustments you need to make to get the most benefit from it and least strain on the back. The headphones would have been the perfect solution. I think I'm going to just keep giving him the withering stare and turning/walking away where possible.

So far I have just kind of mocked what he is saying and given the withering stare. So when he said about not having my drink until the end I pretended as though he was oh so concerned for me and told him not to worry, I have plenty I'm sure it will last in a very insincere manner. Plus the 'oh you are so pathetic' look and he gave up for that session.

I don't think you should leave it until the session starts to tackle this. You will put the instructors in a very difficult position. They will have six patients who have travelled for vital therapy, with many more behind them on waiting lists, waiting to start a class. They will then have a choice of potentially throwing a hand grenade into the room, by dealing with your complaint there and then, having a land mine in the room, by saying they 'haven't really noticed misogynistic language but they'll look out for it and deal with it if it happens' (because they know it will do), or having a ticking time bomb by saying that they'll deal with it after the class, because they know tempers will be frayed and they have to move on to the next appointment any way. They may well be a Band 5/6 physio who is new, also.

You need to speak to the head of department, via the booking secretary, early this week, and if you can't, go through PALS. Tell them that this behaviour is a) sexist b) sexual c) explicit d) overt e) persistent and f) unrelenting in spite of verbal challenge and expression of distaste. Tell them that you feel uncomfortable, and that you don't think it is acceptable that this language is allowed to prevail in an instructor led class, which you have been invited to attend as a therapeutic treatment. Do not apologise for being uncomfortable, but do ask what they can do to stop this, as it is making the class intolerable for you.

^ everything lougle said.

I suggest that every time he speaks to you you say loud and clear "STOP HARASSING ME" as many times as it takes for him to stop. He will stop.

Also please put your complaint to the department in writing. If it is not in writing it did not happen.

In such situations I've found the line: 'You're out of order, mate' useful. It implies that he's a reasonable person who knows what's acceptable and what isn't and that he can control his behaviour. If that doesn't work, escalate to classic assertiveness training: 'When I see you ogling the instructor/ hear you commenting on her breasts it makes me feel unsafe and uncomfortable. It's not acceptable behaviour and I want you to stop doing it.'

If you suspect that anyone else in the group feels the same way you might like to have a word with them and encourage them to add their voice, too.

The physios should have been trained how to manage the situation and it sounds as if they should be intervening. His lack of respect for the professionals around him is shocking and shouldn't be tolerated.

Complain - if he was being racist or homophobic he would have been reported straight away. Why should you as a woman have to put up with sexism?

This is a really difficult situation.

You can see his blatant misogyny. Others will think it's just a bit of bantz.

So you could, in a heartbeat, become a 'feminazi'.

Particularly if other people are not seeing it for what it is.

My preferred option would be to say something on along the lines of oh well dinosaurs will dinosaur.

Or as NotLinkedInSnowedIn says, saying he reminds you of an older man.

It's just a sideswipe.

But it might make him stop, because ego.

"Gawd, you're so like my grandad!"

And what ever he says back.

"Yeah, that's what he says! Lol"

You might make headway by complaining, in which case great.

But sometimes, the 'mood' of the group won't swing your way.

So you are left with little option.

I'm pissed off on your behalf.

Make up a bingo sheet of all the awful things he usually says or does. Print it off and put a title on it - something along the lines of Weinstein-Saville Bingo.

Take it into class with you on a clipboard with a pen.

Don't say anything to him at all - but whenever he says or does anything on it just interrupt what you are doing to cross it off. Have a row of spare boxes to add new awful things in.

Eventually if someone else asks what you are doing explain loudly you were despairing to friends (no need to mention they're on MN!) that you couldn't believe that people with such obviously sexist abusive aggressive idiots existed and worse would think it was big and clever to share those views in public with a group of strangers, particularly after all the stuff in the news about Weinstein, saville etc.

So you thought that the best way to decide was to see how many bad things he came out with in a single session to get their opinions on exactly how far you should take your complaint. Oh and that so far he's scoring pretty 'highly' - don't they agree?