Woman is cultural - TRA on Twitter.

[CisMyArse]

What specific aspect of womanhood is it important to exclude Transwomen from, and why?

I'm in a (currently) polite debate with someone on twitter and I asked them to not use Cis to label me. He asked me how it was possible to determine a difference between trans and cis (???) if Cis wasn't used. He then said Woman by definition is 'cultural' and why was it so relevant to definite it?

Please help me answer this one. I'm not as quick thinking as you lot.

Slightly off-topic but also not: when Lily Madigan and their ilk start talking about womb transplants, I feel sick. Because they’re taking about DEAD WOMEN there.

As if two dead women on average every week, murdered by men, isn’t enough.

Makes me sick.

The reference to karyotyping is, again, bringing people with disorders of sexual development (the ones with extra copies of the sex chromosomes, for example XXY) in as the pawns of transactivists (who don't care about people with DSDs).

There are, of course, other disorders to do with incorrect numbers of chromosomes, trisomy 21 springs to mind immediately, but these are not the people that the transactivists are referring to. They don't seem to realise that chromosomal disorders are not specific to the sex chromosomes. And they don't care about any of these people. They don't even care enough to consider that the effects of extra chromosomes can be quite devastating. :(

I think some men see women as being "not-men" or see men as the norm and women as some kind of deviation from the norm. Wasn't there a (scientific??) belief at one time that women were incomplete men? Therefore, being a woman, to them, isn't a biological reality.

Actually, about 15 years ago, we had our dog neutered & someone said to him (the dog), "Oh dear, you've been turned into a lady dog." I was quite shocked at the time at such a bizarre statement.

From Jennifer James go fund me: “None of us can keep our sex a secret and if we could there would be no pay gap and no #MeToo.“

No pay gap would suggest that men and women were the same and make the same choices. So if being a woman were just a cultural thing then I suspect the above statement would be true. But I believe the real truth is that men and women are different and that this difference is what mostly explains the pay gap. So which is it is it, is the question I guess?

I think some men see women as being "not-men" or see men as the norm and women as some kind of deviation from the norm

Yes. Adam’s rib and all that.

He also said that uteri transplant will be available for men in 10 years time so [to paraphrase], watch this space.
Given that 80% of trans identified males don't get any surgery at all, and that every attempt at implanting a uterus in a male has been fatal, it is quite clear that this person is deluded, or lying, or both.

Deluded, sadly.

I really shy away from saying that “trans” is a kind of mental illness, as that seems so smug. Any kind of bodily dysphoria must be hell.

But really these sorts of ideas do smack of a level of mental unreality that seems close to illness.

and that every attempt at implanting a uterus in a male has been fatal

This is it - if inverting a penis into a cavity is tough, imagine manufacturing the scaffolding to hold a uterus and diverting the blood supplies. And once the uterus is there, presumably to grow a fetus, the hormonal managment, the continued blood and nutrient supply (both controlled by a brain that wasn't expecting to have to do that - how will their body know to increase their blood volume for instance) and the fact that the scaffolding and cavity now needs to stretch to accommodate 5 or 6 kilos of baby and fluids, without crushing their internal organs or causing some kind of prolapse.

It's bad enough for women, who have the structure in place, yet still get stomach muscle separation, hernias and prolapse, and often struggle to breath and have no bladder capacity towards the end, plus of course little things like sleeping on their back can cause the fetus to lie on blood vessels and cause issues (I couldn't sleep on my back from 30 weeks because it made me faint, and I could feel the baby weighing on my internals).

Humans are inventive, but this just seems like a recipe for disaster, and why do it at all, when there is a whole class of humans who are designed for it.

Why not put that effort into making it safer for the humans who can already do it.

Why not put that effort into making it safer for the humans who can already do it.

6th rule of misogyny: Women who go around being female AT men by menstruating and breast feeding babies deserve punishment.

What Swivelchair said, all of that.
I've been on Twitter today and it just makes me so angry, the amount of gaslighting and sheer bullshit that we're just supposed to swallow without question.
I'd ask him if the identifies as an ape as he's just pulling shit out of his arse and chucking it at you.
But seriously if you want to maintain the upper hand, ask him to have the same conversation with his mum and then come back and report exactly how she responded to him.

You know what, tangent, haven't RTFT yet, but the post saying the nobber said womb transplants for men will be availalbe in 10 years time has just made me look forward to the day I can say to a man "should you be eating that?" in the most judgemental manner I can possibly muster.

Well said, swivelchair.

indeed, OP.

cultural appropriation is a really frowned upon isn't it

The thing about Twitter is that it's very "soundbite" nature provides a perfect forum for TRA's.

It's an excellent vehicle to make short, unjustifiable, inflammatory statements littered with hashtags where the ability for anyone to respond fully to the utter crap that's posted is equally curtailed.

It all results in a very reductive argument that invariably comes down to the only "Defense" TRA's have which essentially "my feelings trump biology and you're a bigot for suggesting otherwise".

All the noise about chest feeding/womb implants etc is a distraction from having to defend an ideology that is hokum. Ditto talk of a lady brain.

All the surgical procedures in the world and a buck of hormones won't change your innate sex.

There is an old saying that you are entitled to your opinion and your own beliefs but not your own facts.
The truth has a well known transphobic bias.
And in case you are wondering I am the sound bite queen. If cable news had been invented when I was young I could have been a contender.

Datun I should have listened to you. Now, I'm being told that there is little difference between a vagina and a surgically constructed vagina and why's it important anyway . I'm stepping away - it's impossible to reason with some. Really impossible.

CisMyArse

It really is.

One of the reasons I know they know this ideology is built on a house of cards, is that they never come on here and talk.

They cannot contend with the process of a normal debate.

They can't handle the refutation of dodgy statistics and junk science.

Or the proven whitewashing of autogynephilia.

And the impossible justification of all the rape threats, threats of violence, censorship.

And then, the bit they really can't take is women's opinion.

Women saying no. Just no, mate.

Grab yourself a glass of wine. It's frustrating, I know.

But reason will prevail.

I couldn't stand this. They're really not interested in discussing anything, it's just abuse. Nobody's that stupid to believe that shit.

One of the cruelest things the medial profession has done is to let young people believe that castration and the creation of a cavity in their abdomen is in any way comparable to transplanting an organ like the vagina.

Well, a couple of differences between a neovag and a vagina are that only one of them grows testicale hair in it and only one requires regular stretching to prevent it sealing up. But yeah, totes the same.

And er, one is capable of allowing a baby to travel down into the world from a womb and one... isn't.

And one is self-lubricating and self-cleaning. You don't need special shit to clean it out, like you do with a neo-vag.

I have a medical background and explained quite punchily to a TwitterTIM why his statement that medical progress meant TIMs could become women was nonsense. I’ve never been blocked because normally I’m quite circumspect, but within two seconds of bing attacked with logic, he blocked me and twice posted to call me a transphobic bigot. It was quite impressive how fast it happened.