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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Feminists who are Lord Peter fans......

163 replies

BertrandRussell · 06/02/2018 19:56

I just noticed this reference to domestic violence in Busman’s Honeymoon.
“"O-o-oh! I do hope he won't be violent."

"Violent?" said Harriet, half amused and half angry. "Oh, I shouldn't think so."

But alarm is infectious...and much-tried men have been known to vent their exasperation upon their[Pg 330] servants. The two women clung together, waiting for the explosion.

"Well," said the distant voice, "all I can say is, Bunter, don't let it happen again.... All right.... Good God, man, you needn't tell me that ...of course you didn't.... We'd better go and view the bodies."

The sounds died away, and the women breathed more freely. The dreadful menace of male violence lifted its shadow from the house”

Aren’t those last two sentences chilling?

OP posts:
NorthernLurker · 13/02/2018 10:52

Holtby's best friend Vera Brittain had a very difficult first delivery and post partum period. Her son was very small and struggled to thrive. She was prone to melancholy at the best of times. That may well have influenced characters in South Riding. Holtby's mother was in local government but didn't help her daughter at all. She had to get minutes and agendas out of the wastepaper basket to use as source material. She also probably would have stopped South Riding being published if she could but it was Brittain who was her literary executor and she ensured it happened.

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 13/02/2018 11:34

The reader on Audibie, among many other faux pas pronounced Balliol as in Balham.

I also disagree with her pronounciation of Bredon, but I suppose that’s a matter of opinion......

OP posts:
Vestly · 13/02/2018 11:37

So, how do you pronounce Balliol?
I'm nervous now.

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 13/02/2018 11:39

A Dance to the Music of Time! I had completely forgotten about that!

I remember being very disappointed at the age of about 10 because the title misled me into thinking it might be something I might like- I was a great fan of both ballet books and things like the Wizard of Earthsea and had vague hopes of some sort of combination...........

OP posts:
Original poster
BertrandRussell · 13/02/2018 11:41

Bale-eeol. Not Bal-eeol.

OP posts:
TheXXFactor · 13/02/2018 11:42

Bay-lee-oll

How do you pronounce Bredon?

Vestly · 13/02/2018 11:44

On a side note, on looking up Winifred Holtby, I'm glad to find out that Virago books is still going strong.

Vestly · 13/02/2018 11:45

Whew I had Balliol right.
I'd say Bree-don

Vestly · 13/02/2018 11:47

How do you reckon Death was to be pronounced? In Murder must Advertise, I think, someone gets a shock on hearing the name so I figured it was death but I used to know someone called D'eath pronounced Dee-ath.

TheXXFactor · 13/02/2018 11:51

In one of the books (can't remember which), Peter says he pronounces it in a non-obvious way. Think it was either 'deeth' or 'dee-ath'

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 13/02/2018 11:54

Breedon and De’Ath in my opinion......

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FlaviaAlbia · 13/02/2018 11:59

I only know how to pronounce it because of the radio adaptions, unless they were wrong too Grin Its Bail-e-ol isn't it?

FlaviaAlbia · 13/02/2018 12:00

I got distracted and took far too long to post that Blush

JolieColombe · 13/02/2018 12:08

In Murder Must Advertise he says (in the guise of Bredon) that most people rhyme it with teeth, but he thinks it more picturesque rhymed with breath. Whether he was telling the truth or not is another matter, as he was being Bad Harlequin Bredon at that point Grin

NefretForth · 13/02/2018 18:09

Marking place till I have time to contribute something! I love the Wimsey/Vane books.

borntobequiet · 13/02/2018 19:10

Thanks Northern, that's interesting.

TheXXFactor · 14/02/2018 03:53

Real life has been such a letdown

How true. I never actually fancied Peter - he is too clearly DLS' personal fantasy, plus I have always felt he'd be annoying IRL (see also Mr Darcy). But the idea of finding someone as perfect for you as Peter is for Dorothy Harriet is wonderful and - much as I adore Mr XXfactor - rarely achieved outside the pages of a book.

Teenage boys were a real let-down after I read Strong Poison at about 14 Smile

Vestly · 14/02/2018 10:02

Blimey that's it isn't it. Teenage years reading Dorothy L. Sayers, Margery Allingham, Ngaio Marsh and Edmund Crispin didn't then set me up to see much in spotty youths with little or no conversation who, in general just wanted to do some necking.
Life has indeed been a bit of a let down.

InvisibleUnicorn · 14/02/2018 11:11

Is "The Late Scholar" any good? It's the only one of the Jill PW books I haven't read... I am not sure why I didn't read it as soon as it came out. I own all the others in paperbacks. I don't like kindle much.

It's sitting in my amazon basket at the moment.

Or I could order it for 50p from the library, but it'll be a hardback and a pain to read. Plus, I have the others and it would complete the set I guess.

Somerville · 14/02/2018 11:13

Just imagine you'd been at all-girls Catholic schools, worked hard to get into Oxford, and even chosen your college based on literary heroes (not Somerville, BTW), and then looked around expecting Wimsey-like boyfriends... Blush

InvisibleUnicorn · 14/02/2018 11:55

@Somerville Jill PW did go to Oxford inspired by Dorothy L Sayers. It's clear she was passionate about them, which did make her the best choice to write the follow ups.

I don't know if she found her own Wimsey though.

banivani · 14/02/2018 13:08

Very few people are truly free in their minds to be free of their times, so I've been happily able to let all the classism and snobbery slide. Helps not to be English/British. ;) That short story though about Peter and Harriet beating their eldest son because he really doesn't mind and is quite proud of being strong enough for a hiding - THAT one is tough to swallow. That knocked DLS down of the piedestal. (I choose not to re-read it.)

Original poster
BertrandRussell · 14/02/2018 13:14

The Late Scholar is OK. Makes a quite good audiobook. I liked it better on subsequent listenibga than the first.

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Efferlunt · 14/02/2018 13:24

I don’t find the way the JPW books are written nearly as engaging as DSL. I haven’t read any of the later short stories. Was looking forward to them but not if they involve beating. Which was probably more normal then but I can’t see urbane Peter going for that.

InvisibleUnicorn · 14/02/2018 14:09

Tallboys was written by DLS, and yes I haven't been able to re read it again either. It's included in a short story collection I have of DLS, some of them very interesting indeed. One about cats disappearing I remember. Another about a visiting salesman.

The beating of the son in Tallboys was jarring as I felt it wasn't in keeping with the modern way of parenting Peter and Harriet had. There was a character in the book who was aghast and portrayed very negatively 😔

@BertrandRussell I may try the audio instead then. I have lots of the older audios, even if I also have the books.