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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Good Old Fashioned Sexism, '70's Style, From Virgin Trains.

98 replies

ALunerExplorer · 02/01/2018 11:58

Virgin Trains responding to highlighted sexism with... more sexism. The non-apology apology will be arriving at Platform 2 as scheduled.

Good Old Fashioned Sexism, '70's Style, From Virgin Trains.
OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 19:43

If it had been me I would probably just have said at the time "don't be so rude".

I'm also assuming that this was yet another cock-up on the reserved seating. Emily says the first class coach was empty. There are always 3 first class coaches on the Edinburgh to London trains and they are never empty, far from it. On 27/12 I would have expected the First Class to be full by First Class sold tickets but the seat reservations weren't on the seats so somebody mistakenly thought First was available.They managed to do that on a London train I was on at the beginning of December. There would have been a riot if they had allowed cheap upgrades of Standard class tickets.

Elendon · 03/01/2018 19:54

Couple of things.

Just because you would probably react differently doesn't mean every one else has to act like you. Saying such things is not helpful.

I've had an upgrade on Virgin Trains. It was first come, first served - there were no reservations in first class. It was a very comfortable and pleasant journey.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 20:05

Just because you would probably react differently doesn't mean every one else has to act like you. Saying such things is not helpful

Fgs it was not intended to be helpful or unhelpful. I was simply commenting on what I would have done had it happened to me. Stop policing what can be posted here. I don't use Twitter. I would have made my displeasure known at the time- if I felt particularly strongly I would have followed it up in writing.

I travel regularly on Virgin East Coast first class between London, Edinburgh and Aberdeen. The vast majority of seats are reserved (and it is essential if you are using one of the cheaper Advance First Tickets. Even if I have full open First Class Ticket I generally reserve a seat)- occasionally they mess up the reservations. This happened on 3 of the trains I was on over the holiday period.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 20:08

I said nothing about every one else has to act like you. You however are seeking to dictate what can or can't be posted.

AssassinatedBeauty · 03/01/2018 20:19

No she's not. She's just telling you that your post is unhelpful not that you shouldn't have posted it.

UpABitLate · 03/01/2018 20:22

Where in the UK is "honey" a regional standard to call men and women? I've not heard that one before.

I agree that in some areas my lover etc are AOK and standard, however it's about intent. She said he was patronising her with his use of "honey" while dismissing her complaint, I think we've all been in positions like this to imagine his tone.

For people to jump at her being offended for the sake of being offended ie calling her a liar is weird.

The response from Virgin is a big fuck you to her and to women who don't want to be patronised by random men, which I agree is deliberate and par for the course for Virgin, they had ads fairly recently saying come on our planes business guys because look sexy ladies didn't they? And said it was retro and fun Hmm

UpABitLate · 03/01/2018 20:25

Oh wow it was more than a couple of years ago!!!

At the end it says they lost a sex discrimination claim in Oz.

Hasn't Branson been accused of sexual misconduct as well, before metoo?

UpABitLate · 03/01/2018 20:26

So really this is all on message with the company brand.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 20:40

AssassinatedBeauty

No she's not. She's just telling you that your post is unhelpful not that you shouldn't have posted it

Fine I find Elendon's response unhelpful . The point of this forum is debate . It is hardly debate to leap upon any other possible response to the incident and declare it as " unhelpful". As if any other response beyond a somewhat badly written tweet is valid. Elendon's response also twisted what I said.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 20:41

For people to jump at her being offended for the sake of being offended ie calling her a liar is weird

Nobody has called her a liar.

AssassinatedBeauty · 03/01/2018 20:44

"As if any other response beyond a somewhat badly written tweet is valid."

No one has said that at all. Just that simply stating what you would have done is irrelevant. I'm sure lots of people would have done lots of different things in response. That's not very helpful on its own.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 03/01/2018 20:55

For people to jump at her being offended for the sake of being offended ie calling her a liar is weird.

No one has called her a liar but perhaps if you keep repeating that often enough it will be accepted as true. Assainated Beauty did a piece of creative writing anyalysis on Windy's post and came to the incorrect assumption Windy was saying she was lying.

Really quite stunning that my commenting on what I as a woman and a regular user of Virgin East Coast might have done is getting dismissed as "unhelpful" but a fictitious statement that some one said she was lying gets a free pass.

You really thinking continuing to harp on about people saying she is lying is helpful when no one said anything of the kind?

thebewilderness · 03/01/2018 20:57

When women are expected to tolerate behaviors from men, that men are not, it isn't really tolerance. It is submission.

WindyWindy · 03/01/2018 21:06

I've given up Lass.

I just lost a post repeating I don't assume anyone lies, but since I described a bit of " what I would do" I've thought better of reposting it.

Suffice to say I've had a few run ins on the west coast line over the years.

UpABitLate · 03/01/2018 21:17

All of the people who have said that the man was simply using a standard fugue of speech, when the woman has said he was rude and patronising, are saying that they don't believe her. They are saying that he was fine and normal and non patronising and that she is imagining it, making it up or lying. That she is claiming something happened that didn't in order to make a fuss about nothing/ attention seek/ make life difficult for nice chaps/ whatever.

UpABitLate · 03/01/2018 21:19

"crying sexism" is one such example.

That's figure not fugue btw sorry on phone

WindyWindy · 03/01/2018 21:23

That's not me then upabitlate , that is not a fair summary of what I have said.

TheCowWentMoo · 03/01/2018 22:11

Anything that would happen between friends is completely irrelevant. She was making a complaint, I'm pretty certain even with various regional terms that we all know its not appropriate to use "honey" when a customer is making a complaint. It was patronising. Do you really think he would have called another middle aged man "honey"? Of course he wouldn't! There is no where in the country where a man would call another man honey in a professional context.

TheSmallClangerWhistlesAgain · 03/01/2018 22:51

VT may have brushed the complaint off, but they never denied it. I'm absolutely sure it happened based on that alone. It would be "can you give a time/date/location and we'll look into it" if they had any doubt.

UpABitLate · 04/01/2018 11:23

Where on earth did I say it was you windy? I didn't direct my post at anyone in particular...

Are you always this self centred? Grin

WindyWindy · 04/01/2018 11:55

Of course I noticed you named no names.

But with what had been occuring with other posters extrapolating my posts I wanted to be clear.😀

I'd not combed others posts. No more self obsessed than anyone else giving opinions on here I hope!

Elendon · 04/01/2018 17:31

Stop policing what can be posted here.

I'm not policing Lass, I'm helpfully offering advice. To be frank, I'm surprised you gave what your response would be, giving your professional background. I don't care how you would respond. It has no bearing on this particular incident. Whatsoever.

To refresh I was commenting on this from Lass

If it had been me I would probably just have said at the time "don't be so rude".

And yet, you didn't respond to me by saying 'don't be so rude'.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 04/01/2018 18:27

All of the people who have said that the man was simply using a standard fugue of speech, when the woman has said he was rude and patronising, are saying that they don't believe her. They are saying that he was fine and normal and non patronising and that she is imagining it, making it up or lying. That she is claiming something happened that didn't in order to make a fuss about nothing/ attention seek/ make life difficult for nice chaps/ whatever

That is an inventive interpretation of "lying".

Lying means she is lying that the incident happened at all.

Nobody on here has said that.

Some posters have attempted to minimise the incident but no-one has said she lied about it or made it up or imagined it or claimed something happened that didn't - nor for that matter that she made the claim to look for compensation.

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