Times article - Greening delays plans to reform GRA

[Betti935]

thetimes.co.uk/article/b3fe92ae-e81c-11e7-a174-4895c8d54551

I think it's good news. I think the government originally imagined this would be a nice, feel good piece of socially liberal legislation, like same sex marriage, that would give everyone a warm glow and attract the youth vote.

They've realised it's more complicated to that. I'm sure much of that is down to the fantastic efforts of Janice Turner, who was the first to raise it in the national press. Obviously it's since been taken up by others, the latest being Leo McKinstry in the Express (www.express.co.uk/comment/columnists/leo-mckinstry/895046/transgender-madness-2017-year-insanity). I normally regard McKinstry as being a pretty nasty right-wing journalist, but there you go - the left have been very reluctant to stand up for women's rights, unfortunately. And obviously from the point of view of a Tory government, the last thing they want is to be deserted by their natural supporters.

The number of women who have written to their MP to raise this as an issue has also no doubt helped - so a pat on the back to everyone who has done this. Even if you had a pathetic fobbing off letter from your MP (as I did), they'll now be aware that it's an issue that constituents are worried about, and that will make them nervous.

Any shift in the right direction is good, but I notice it is the LBGT community she appears to be particularly concerned about, rather than women generally. Still a cross party group opposed to the proposals is good - they have been rather quiet though apart from David Davies.

On another thread I reported a response from my (Conservative) MP. He has forwarded my concerns to Greening and asked for a response, which he will forward to me. He put a handwritten PS on his letter saying he was concerned and would be watching developments closely. He has had a number of local people expressing concerns about it. So all good there.

WhoPutthecatout My MP wrote to her too, my concerns were a variety, women, lesbians, trans/gay and ASC children being steralised, people with disabilities like Dementia and LD who will be sought for hate crimes because they don't understand. I queried how the needs of each protection characteristic groups were being balanced.

I imagine the reason they're concerned about LGB rights is because the gay lobby is quite vocal, and, having introduced gay marriage, they don't now want to be seen as the party that tramples on gay rights. Whereas they know most women won't make a fuss, and those who do can be dismissed as radical feminists.

Maybe reading evidence from lesbians being forced to take male bodies or be called transphobic was enough to make her stop and think? You can't force someone to be sexually attracted to someone they aren't attracted to.

Now maybe Justine Greening will have a look at what GIRES and Mermaids are doing with their DfE funding! Promoting children taking off label drugs that will negatively impact on their bodies for ever. Breaking lesson one of safeguarding rules when telling adults that they can keep a child's disclosure about gender confusion confidential.
That will do for starters.

I'm assuming however that even then all those who have sued schools and gained access to segregated facilities will still be able to access them?

The schools, Guides etc who have put children at risk deserve law suits and public condemnation.

This will all cause a bad backlash on the gender non conforming people, which is sad.

The narcissistic types taking over sports and Travis/changing rooms, I have little sympathy for.

Giles I think it will make a difference if self-ID does not become law even if many organisations are acting as if it's already law.

It means that it remains possible to legally challenge those orgs for not applying the law correctly in their policies. In the current climate it would take a lot of bravery for people to do that but it is possible and if/when the tide turns it will become easier.

Once self ID makes it into primary legislation all hope of that is gone.

I really hope so.

And yes I hope legally everywhere is legally pulled apart for their reckless approaches

I notice it is the LBGT community she appears to be particularly concerned about

She’s a lesbian who has only recently come out publicly so I suspect that will have an impact.

There have been rumours around Education for a while that she’s due a promotion so maybe she’s planning on keeping her head down for a bit on anything potentially contentious.

I doubt the Tories ever intended to push this through, not with their track record.
But what about Labour? Will they back down now? Or would they push it through if they come to power?

Wow, dare I allow a little optimism to enter my thoughts?! This is definitely great news, if nothing else it gives us more time to get the message out to people.

Congratulations to the regular posters here who have tirelessly made the arguments. I'm sure this made a real difference, as it would have encouraged women to write to their MPs. It's quite an achievement to have at least slowed down the advance of this movement, unlike in Canada for example.

I suspect this is Dunkirk rather than VE Day. The PM has hitched herself to the cause by declaring that transgender is not a mental illness. Then there's Scotland. And regardless of legislation, organisations like Girl Guides and schools are effectively replacing sex with subjective gender identification.

cromeyellow0 is right.
The damage is already being done in schools - even the National Association of Headteachers have issued guidelines specifying that any self ID person must immediately have access to gendered facilities and any member of staff who objects must go elsewhere - so that promptly excludes any member of staff who can't share changing facilities / toilets with the opposite sex for religious, reasons, dignity, personal preference.
Of course no doubt written by men people who have never struggled with managing the side effects of heavy periods, dysmenorrhea, pregnancy etc in a busy school where you barely have time to pee, let alone deal with managing your privacy.
We absolutely need to increase the pressure so that the Guides, the NAHT and other organisations begin to amend these guidelines. We have to show that they are actively excluding women and girls and making them unsafe in places where their safety should be paramount.

This is good news, but just dropping it isn’t enough. Most public sector bodies use self ID now, we need to demand exemptions are actually used.

A little glimmer of hope.

Must. Keep. Going.

"And regardless of legislation, organisations like Girl Guides and schools are effectively replacing sex with subjective gender identification."

Awful though that is, I don't think it's viable in the long term. At some point, there'll be a group of angry parents who have discovered their teenage daughters have been forced to share a tent with a teenage boy, and they'll be absolutely furious. And they'll sue the arses off the Guides.

It might not be the Guides, it might be something else, but whatever it is, you can bet your bottom dollar that the parents won't go, "Oh, it's fine for my daughter to be sharing with a teenage boy, I mustn't be prejudiced." Because, actually, most normal people who aren't politically active, haven't got a clue that this stuff is going on, and haven't got a clue that objecting to it makes them evil transphobic bigots who deserve to be shot.

I doubt Greening will ever use the words "so called feminists" again

In fairness, that was Maria Miller.

Hopefully, as a gay woman, Greening has lesbian friends who are alerting her to the threat that TRAs pose to women, gay women in particular.

We need to keep up the pressure though - because you can be sure that TRAs will now be ramping up the bullying and manipulation.

because you can be sure that TRAs will now be ramping up the bullying and manipulation.

Like sensationalist headlines in the times/express/daily mail, panic filled letters to MP's... oh wait.

wandersail
It's amazing what a couple of months of open debate is like after several years of deliberate silencing "#nodebate"
Such a surprise to hear women protesting about our erasure and people worrying about the harm being done to children in the name of this 'movement'.

Open discussion in a democratic society is not bullying - unless of course 'transphobia' is defined as 'anything I don't like hearing'

Open discussion in a democratic society is not bullying - unless of course 'transphobia' is defined as 'anything I don't like hearing'

Sadly guardianfree that appears to be what many consider to be bullying. It's bizarre.

When people are used to getting their own way, it probably does feel like oppression when someone finally says "no".

Bloody hell I just went into the Scottish five website to respond to their consultation. They seem to be full on lemming in their approach. Some of the questions made me consider new horrors I hadn’t even imagined. Such as should a gender reassignment cease to be a valid cause for divorce. Meaning you could find yourself as a woman in a marriage to a “woman” against your will. WTF.

Filled in the consultation though I’m not in Scotland. Plus I’m only a woman so I don’t count on any level.