The trans movement in 30, 40, 50 years...?

[imafuckityfuckingfucktard]

I'm new to the feminist boards but have been reading with interest these last several months.

I wonder whether the trans-movement will get greater with time at the expense of women's rights, or implode altogether when more and more young people speak out about ending up in irreversibly botched bodies later down the line...?

I honestly have little clue, but would be interested in discussing with people. Thanks in advance for your replies!

That's my point exactly, Elendon. The men and boys in my house leave the seat up always after peeing and it drives me mad. In a public loo, I would be equally peed off, so to speak.

There will be a lot more stories like this with people left miserable after gender reassignment surgery is botched. The more operations happen, the greater number of people will be left with disfigurements, even if some are happy with how their surgeries have gone.

I don't see how they can be NOT botched.

Removing a penis and testicles is a major operation. It's not just the quick snip that dogs/cats/horses get, it' removal of a major organ, cutting off multiple blood vessels and nerves, followed by seriously complicated reconstruction.

And construction of a vagina can't be easy. A vagina isn't just a "slit" for sticking a penis into, it's a major organ, that changes appearance and size depending on outside stimulation. Simply inverting a penis won't be sufficient.

I don't see how surgeons can bring themselves to do this - mutilate healthy bodies to satisfy mental health urges

No doctor would remove a healthy limb, or healthy eyes, or give an underweight person a gastric band, or cut a healthy spinal cord, or even perform any sort of brain zapping/lobotomy these days. So what makes "gender reassignment" different?

It's essentially cosmetic surgery. AndI suppose there are always doctors willing to implant damagingly massive boobs, or strange bums. Indeed, some of the lip/cheekbone stuff they do these days that makes mostly women, but also some men, look completely inhuman surely can't pretend to be "medical" procedures.

That story is so sad Copperkettles

Poor Kim was sold a pup. Surely counselling and coming to terms with the body you were born with is preferable to what happened to her.

What about the dystopian version? What if in 50 years, so many people have destroyed their own fertility that there are only a small number of fertile women left? Will those women be valued by society, or enslaved as in The Handmaid's Tale?

Whatever happens in the next few decades, the fallout will be huge. There are a lot of people being used and abused.

There is a real belief within some medical professionals, and in NHS commissioning services that gender dysphoria is a biological (somatic) problem so surgery and hormones are the most effective treatment. This is the transactivists ideology. And that questioning this approach is paternalistic gatekeeping.

There is a real belief

A belief?

Working with patients post surgery (not transition surgery, lots of other types) does make me wonder how anyone can put themselves through anything like this. I admire surgeons immensely but stuff goes wrong and even 'normal ' recovery is no walk in the park.

It does lead me to conclude that to those undergoing this, they regard it as essential, which takes some of the angst out.But I would like to know more about the process of consent for these operations.

Stop do you have any research or papers to support your statement regarding NHS professionals? Because when I looked for articles and research about post-surgery outcomes, I didn't find anything that stated dysphoria was biological or that hormones and surgery helped with outcomes.

That was from the minutes of an NHS consultation workshop. I'll try and find it. There is very little or poor evidence about the success of hormones and surgery.

This is the recent policy consultation document - check out the evidence section. I would be very interested to find out which other treatments are recommended with such poor evidence. I am not a scientist but there seem to be massive gaps in knowledge, some of it very outdated and probably dealing with older transsexuals from 20 years ago, very little consideration of the different causes/ types of gender dysphoria or any attempt to acknowledge the current epidemic of trans identifying teenage girls. And then whilst acknowledging how poor the evidence base is, then goes on to specify treatments in a pretty robust manner.

www.engage.england.nhs.uk/consultation/specialised-services-consultation/user_uploads/gendr-ident-policy.pdf

Am going to try and take a break for a couple of days (my brain is about to explode with all this) but will come back when I can.