I'm scared to ask why this is wrong but trans is ok

[Sisinisawa]

A fairly well known person I follow has posted this on Facebook and the comments are full of how wrong it is and how angry they all are.

I'm scared to ask why this is wrong but they think trans is ok (I know they think this) but I really want to know.

Is anyone brave enough to post a public discussion on this somewhere so I can join in?

Not really sure what the issue is?and how it's linked to trans issues? Is it the proactive pics or the mention of black history?

I've left FB recently OP but I'm with you in spirit! One of the reasons I left was because I was dying to have a rant about trans activists but couldn't risk the wrath of Facebook...

Jellybean its Rachel Dolezal who claims to be black when she isn't.

It is the contradiction implicit in championing men who insist they are women, because they identify as women, whilst castigating someone who insists they are black because they identify as black.

I'm with you op.

I get you op. I hope one day soon, people like this have a sudden realisation that these two issues are very similar.

Why does she think she is black? Is she defining characteristics by colour? And feels that her characteristics are those of a black woman?

I'm just trying to get a perspective btw!

always
www.thestranger.com/features/2017/04/19/25082450/the-heart-of-whiteness-ijeoma-oluo-interviews-rachel-dolezal-the-white-woman-who-identifies-as-black

Basically she had a shit childhood and black adopted siblings, felt accepted and at home with black people so "identified" as black.

She identifies as black, and believe in being trans racial as o he can be transgender. www.independent.co.uk/news/people/rachel-dolezal-white-woman-black-racial-fluidity-accepted-transracial-naacp-a7653131.html The fact that she was the leader of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, before it was discovered she was actually white, was a huge scandal.

OP I have been wondering this for ages but too scared to ask. Thanks for the thread. I would love someone to explain this.

This makes me mad. Why can't people see it's essentially the same argument? So Rachel gets booted out of her job because she wasn't born black but Lily/Liam is welcomed with open arms as a women's officer because it's how you identify that counts. World's gone bloody crazy.

I think often about the treatment of Rachel Dolezal compared with TRAs.

Rachel pretended to be black and yes, she took, scholarships, jobs and roles from black people and she lied to that community, I'm not excusing that. However, (from what I know from a few articles) she spent her life diligently representing the black community. She didn't try to redefine the black community to include white people. She didn't call the black community racist and she didn't hate those people. She wasn't saying as a trans-black person she was more oppressed and other black people should budge up for her and other trans black people.

I had a discussion with a transwoman about Dolezal. He said that people can have a deep inner sense of being the assigned the wrong gender, but race doesn't work that way. He also felt that he'd inherited a sense of femaleness from his mum, grandma etc, but you can't inherit a sense of blackness if you're white. Something like that.

This is from a guardian interview with Rachel:

'Is racial identity as fluid as gender?
“It’s more so. Because it wasn’t even biological to begin with. It was always a social construct.”

Trans commentatorshave been incensed by the suggestion of parallels. “Transgender people transition out of medical necessity,” wrote one. “Dolezal’s ‘transition’ to black, on the other hand, is surrounded by layers of deception.” They argue that her colour was a choice, so cannot be analogous to their gender identity. But if we believe someone born without ovaries or a womb can be a woman, and accept radical surgery as a legitimate corrective necessity, is it so different for a woman who is born white but feels black to reposition herself on the racial spectrum?'

I really like how she does actually point out that being a different race lacks that biological difference that being a different sex does, and therefore makes it more fluid.

There's nothing wrong with it

Nothing wrong with what Butterflies?

Being trans race. She's not hurting anyone. Let her do her.

Sisi - thanks, i must be a bit cultrually off that radar...thank goodness.
My DD has a child at her sschool who is currently identifying as a unicorn and insisting on wearing glitter makeup everyday....school apparently worried about upsetting her are going along with this...wtaf?
so i can trump a identifies as black when my skin colour is not...

"She's not hurting anyone."

What about the black people who could have benefited from the scholarships she took?

Of course she’s hurting people. She is not only identifying as something she isn’t, and therefore making it a matter of opinion, she is taking the job of a black person.

When, at any time, she can simply identify out of that cohort and become white when it suits.

Which she did.

She sued/challenged the university, on the basis of race, because she was white.

It’s about equality, again. If black people and white people were completely equal, none of it would matter. If men and women were completely equal, none of it would matter.

Everyone would be equally represented.

It’s impossible for her to understand what is like to have been born black, because when she wants to, she can stop.

I had a discussion with a transwoman about Dolezal. He said that people can have a deep inner sense of being the assigned the wrong gender, but race doesn't work that way. He also felt that he'd inherited a sense of femaleness from his mum, grandma etc, but you can't inherit a sense of blackness if you're white. Something like that.

That's complete nonsense.

I also don't get why anorexics are treated for body dysmorphia but men-who-want-to-be-women are allowed to be women.

Tran-racial and trans-gender...the arguments for and against both are exactly the same. So it makes no sense at all to me how 'trans-racial' is deemed so awful where trans-gender is apparently all fine and even 'brave'.

I've decided I'm a 'trans millionaire'.

Basically I feel like a millionaire. I identify as a millionaire. Sadly, my bank account doesn't reflect my financial identity.

I therefore am insisting that the government allows me to live as my true self and provides me with the required funds to do so.

I really like how she does actually point out that being a different race lacks that biological difference that being a different sex does, and therefore makes it more fluid.

I agree.

Unlike biological sex, it’s not easy to objectively determine ethnicity in an individual.

I look ‘white’, am perceived as such, but for all I know I could have fairly recent ‘black’ ancestors and not know about it. In that case, does how ‘black’ I am depend on my awareness of it, other people’s awareness of it, my socialisation and lived experience or the outcome of some sort of genetic analysis? And who gets to decide?

In the end, what matters is that nobody (who doesn’t harm others) is marginalised and impoverished.

Identity politics, if it will get us anywhere, is taking us the scenic route.