What happens when the Scouts outsources its policy writing to Mermaids?

[pisacake]

It's as mad as you'd expect.

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4228/gender-identity-supporting-young-people?cat=377,378&moduleID=10

"Gender identity issues do not just affect adults; children even as young as 2 years old can be diagnosed with ‘gender dysphoria’ or ‘gender identity disorder’."

Start em young!

"The young person has a right to be treated as their true gender irrespective of what stage they are at. "

where true gender presumably means their 'trans' gender, because nobody ever ever changes their mind, right?

Disabled toilets are a no-go, sorry they are trans toilets now :

"refer to and label toilets appropriately (e.g. ‘unisex/accessible toilets’ rather than ‘disabled’)"

Binding your breasts is completely normal and harmless

"Young people who are developing breasts may strap down their chest, to make it less obvious. This is called ‘binding’ and it is important to respect the young person’s decision to do this."

"If you have young people who are binding their chests, monitor them carefully during particularly physical activities (such as rock climbing) and hot temperatures. There is a chance that the binding could cause discomfort or even impair breathing, and it may be necessary to subtly offer more breaks."

Wonder what the protocol is if you collapse because you can't fucking breathe? Is it transphobic to remove the binder?

Girls and boys toilets also transphobic

"Wherever possible, select a venue that has unisex toilet facilities "

Always prioritise the feelings of the trans person above everyone else.
"There is no rule in Scouting stating that young people must be split by gender for sleeping arrangements. "
"Sharing with other young people of their true gender (or their biological sex if they would prefer), either in large or small tents with their trusted friends."

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4227

"What causes it?
The most recent scientific research suggests that it is strongly associated with the development of the brain in the womb."

Hmm, do the Scouts have a biology badge?

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4229

"People who are transgender have a right to be treated as their acquired gender, regardless of what (if any) medical or legal steps they have taken. "

WRONG. They have a right not to be discriminated against, except where lawful.

"You do not need to ask for proof for their records to be altered (e.g. to show their Gender Recognition Certificate).
"

Yeah who needs to bother with silly paperwork, it's not like record keeping is important or anything, amirite?

How are the two statements on tent sharing not directly contradictory? How can you reconcile a preference for sharing with others of one's "true gender" with a competing preference for sharing with one's "biological sex"?

I think it means that the feelings of the trans person take priority. They can choose whichever tent they prefer, biological sex or 'true gender.' Any other young person who might feel uncomfortable sharing with them is of course a transphobic bigot and should be ignored.

What if there's a load of trans identified boys who want to share with the girls (their "true gender ") and a load of trans identified girls who want to share only with their biological sex?

What if the boys are happy to share with trans boys but feel uncomfortable with a trans girl or vice versa? You literally can't have it both ways.

The most recent scientific research suggests that it is strongly associated with the development of the brain in the womb."

Incredible. WHAT EVIDENCE? WHAT RESEARCH? where is their citation? the peer reviews?

Sometimes I think Cordelia Fine should be required reading for every single person before they make stupid fucking proclamations on gender.

What is the law?
Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act 2010, whether or not the person is undergoing medical treatment. This means that as with ‘disability’, organisations have a duty to make reasonable adjustments to ensure that trans Members can access Scouting, including anticipating the needs of any future members.

FFS they're just making it up as they go along!

The term 'reasonable adjustments' only applies to the protected characteristic of disability. There's a lot said about RA in the equality act and all of it - every single paragraph and sub paragraph relates to people with disabilities and nobody else.

I googled it. Top hit

is Transas City transascity.org/the-transgender-brain/

It co-opts a whole bunch of intersex conditions to fraudulently imply a link to transgender.

What if there's a load of trans identified boys who want to share with the girls (their "true gender ") and a load of trans identified girls who want to share only with their biological sex?

Any girls who want to share only with their biological sex will be spirited away to the special room marked 'TERFS' so I can't imagine that being a popular option...

Oh god that link.

What the actual fuck?

Trans people are not intersex for gods sake.

Surely if that’s true then scientists could just do a test to see where we were on the ‘sex spectrum’ or whatever guff they call it and then we could all go home.

Bloody hell

Why Can't there just be guidelines in plave to just allow all the members to just be who they are and celebrate that without it meaning there's something wrong with them.

Why are we encouraging this with kids so much so that we allow them to risk even being able to breathe just to fall over ourselves to be politically correct.

Why part of roaming through woods building camp fires and playing games requires breasts or a penis? It's all "neutral" surely?

Leave them alone and stop making them share personal spaces with the opposite sex to prove a point.

Poor kids

As a former scout leader, I can't quite sum up the words to express my level of wtf at this.

A room marked TERFs, huh? Starting to sound perfect to me. It can stand for Totally Excellent Restroom Facilities.

Bit American, but the best I can do.

Miranda and other equally TERF-y transwomen can come in as usual.

Quite aside from the adult/child safeguarding issues, what are Scouts and/or Guides going to do when someone's daughter comes home from a camping trip having got pregnant?

Hand out leaflets on how babies can be transgender too?

Is that when a baby boy undoes the poppers on his babygro, pisacake? Trying to turn it into a dress, obviously. Must be trans.

(No, this is not just me being ridiculous, it's apparently one of the reasons Jazz Jennings' parents knew Jazz was trans )

The average two year old, in an average morning, is likely to identify as things as varied as a dinosaur, a table, and a dog.

How can anyone write such utter bollocks? And why are the (generally sensible) scouts endorsing it?

I can only assume none of you have trans kids. Mine did start asking around 2 if if he could grow up to be a boy. He cut his hair whenever he could get hold of scissors. Do you honestly think parents force this on their children? Why on earth would you do that when it is so hard for them, and us, to go down that road?
I've had my share of crap from the patriarchy, but I would say it is NOTHING like what he has to put up with. Every day, every single day he goes out the door. At least there's SOMEWHERE I CAN PEE without someone throwing me out.

Mine was in Scouts, and credit to them, they tried. Mostly. They didn't let him go in the tent with biological boys, but other than that they tried. What is so wrong with them at least trying to make things just a little bit easier for kids that really, really don't have it easy?

Do you think any kid has it easy though?

Do you not think tht every single chikd in that hall could have been through stuff that makes their life hard?

Divorce, adoption, abuse, eating disorders, disabilities, hectic home lives, restricting allergies, cancer etc

What makes one chikd any more special than all the others meaning they draw they short straw in having their comfort and privacy invaded?

I think my children must be a bit thick because, aged two, I don’t think they had a meaningful concept of ‘growing up to be’ an anything.

Explain why a child undergoing chemo for instance has to undergo chemo feel like shit loose her hair then share a tent witg a boy having to indulge delusions to make them feel better.

I'd expect Scouts to be kind to kids going through any of the above Giles . Though yes, I do think some kids have it easy. Some don't. Does that make it wrong for organisations like Scouts to try not to be discriminatory? I think if a child was going through chemo the Scouts would ask them who they wanted to share a tent with.

But how would they be discriminatory? Either all the kids do activities or they don't. What are they doing that means it's awkward for a child to do as themselves

And separating by sex for toilets sleeping and changing is not discriminatory in the slightest

To me it looks like the advice is there to help leaders not be discriminatory by trying to explain what issues might arise.

Separating for toilets and sleeping can be discriminatory, if you are forced to go to the toilet/sleeping place that you don't think is the one that accords with your gender. Both boys and girls can go to Scouts. Mostly they look like the gender of their biological sex. Some transkids may pass - if the Scout leaders know they are trans and make them use the toilet of the gender they don't identify with (ie. female toilets if they are a transboy) that will out them.
I can see the problem with the sleeping, obviously.