We must stop apologising

[StealthPolarBear]

I've started a thread like this before but I've just been to a talk by three people, all asked as they're experts in their fields. It was really noticeable to me that the two men just spoke and when they'd finished they stopped. The woman's first and last words were "sorry".
I know I do it myself although I am desperate to stop. It is a female thing isn't it. We must stop apologising for sharing our extensive expertise!

Thank you for starting this thread op, I have been nearly starting one for a while to ask advice on how to avoid using 'just' in my buissiness emails. I have no reason to downplay or excuse the requested I am making of the people I'm writing to but struggle to phrase it differently.

Oh, and 'I think'. I try to avoid adding that too.

Oh, and 'I think'.

I say this all the time

I remember reading that when researchers ring women experts asking them to appear on programmes they are inclined to assume they are being asked to recommend someone.....

You can remove "just" in most cases without having to rephrase or reword, simply take it out of the sentence.

I'm conflicted on this.

I use some of these words. But why should we all adapt our language to confirm with a stereotypical confident male pattern of speech? What's wrong with the way women typically talk to one another - perhaps collaborative, showing empathy etc. Maybe the decisive, no nonsense tone isn't the only appropriate one?

I know I'm right. In my area I am knowledgeable and can make the right decisions and judgement calls. Talking like this undermines me.

This isn't a female / male thing at all. I catch myself doing this and also notice others (male and female) doing the same. Maybe I see more of it on grounds that e gineers are barely socially functional! Lots of reasons driving why this happens and i think its probably a good opportunity for self improvement, but a female trait? No, sorry about that!

"but a female trait? No, sorry about that!"

Wht makes you think that?

I use some of these words. But why should we all adapt our language to confirm with a stereotypical confident male pattern of speech? What's wrong with the way women typically talk

I will say "sorry this is a bit boring" because there will always be chunks of statutes in talks I give which are boring and then skip over them as they are in the lecture notes. This is not an exclusively female trope. Otherwise I'm a pretty confident speaker- why not? I know my stuff, I will have rehearsed the talk and people are paying to hear me.

@CappuccinoCake I know what you mean, but for me personally I realised that I felt I had to phrase things carefully and apologetically. I realised I actually prefer to be direct and unapologetic, it fits more with my personality. I think you can be collaborative and empathic as well though, it's not one or the other.

It is far more common in women than men engineer
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.livescience.com/8698-study-reveals-women-apologize.html

It’s true.

Never JADE - justify, apologise defend or explain. If you do, your apologising and if you’re apologising you’re wrong. Stop it.

Language is important. For example, ‘but.’

Never use but. Everything before the buy is negated if you use but. Try ‘at the same time.’ This gives both statements a more equal weight and it stops people being instantly on the defensive to shoot you down.

The sheer thrill I got at work when I tried this the first time. No ‘I’d love to but I need to and I blah blah.’ Just ‘no.’ Wonderful.

You’re apologising- bloody autocorrect

Lass I agree , thats the kind of sorry I might use. I'm not sure we should all have to start censoring speech and speak differently just to rid ourselves of so called feminine features - the "we must stop apologising."

I suspect I'm not phrasing myself well! (Sorry ;) )

What I am trying to say is that presenting yourself in a confident and non-apologetic, empowered way could be seen as unfeminine,at least when you feel you are physically not typically attractive. I do this. I am quite confident but downplaying my confidence routinely

Sorry (there you go- proving a point) but that sounds complete tosh. The last conference I spoke at was chaired by a woman, with 5 speakers (2 male and 3 female) to a mixed audience of around 200 people. None of the women behaved in the way you describe.

This sort of stuff irritates me immensely. If women want to be taken seriously then behave seriously and cut out this hand wringing.

So true

If only everyone had your bombproof confidence @LassWiTheDelicateAir.

"I know I'm right"
I meant in general when talking about my work. Not specifically on this thread. Sorry... Sorry...bye...sorry

I think that was clear from the context of your post @StealthPolarBear. Certainly I understood that's what you meant.

I reread it and thought I didbt remember being such an arrogant dick

But why should we all adapt our language to confirm with a stereotypical confident male pattern of speech? What's wrong with the way women typically talk to one another - perhaps collaborative, showing empathy etc. Maybe the decisive, no nonsense tone isn't the only appropriate one?

True dat. I certainly really like to hear men sounding more doubtful and ambiguous, and it gives me more confidence in their abilities to see both sides of the problem, rather than steamroller everything in an ego-driven frenzy.

Myself, I'm presently trying to eradicate exclamation marks from my work emails. I don't need to let everybody know how non-serious (hence non threatening) I am, do I !!!!!!!!!!

Women definitely do it more. I hate how lacking in confidence I feel at work most of the time but I’m starting to get fed up with my boss talking over me.

He waffles so much and I just want to get him to the point so I find myself saying “sorry can I just say”. I’m going to make a conscious effort to stamp it out.

I do it less than I used to but still too much. People bump into me & I apologise or if I have to complain, I start with “ Sorry” when I’m not at all!

I feel like I annoy people by speaking

This is me too. I'm generally totally certain I'm right but I assume I'll annoy people even more by being right than I would if I were wrong