TERFs again

[AnotherSpartacus]

Over on another, student-centric forum, I've just been trying to explain how the word 'TERF' is typically used as an insult. I linked to terfisaslur.com/ only to be told that TERFs apparently say 'much worse' to transwomen all the time. No response when I asked where all the threats of violence, rape and death from feminists directed at transwomen were, unsurprisingly. They also seemed unable to differentiate consistently between gender identity and biological sex, which made any real discussion impossible. Very frustrating.

Anyway, the point of this thread is that I was linked to this page as an explanation of why calling women TERFs is acceptable: rationalwiki.org/wiki/Trans-exclusionary_radical_feminism There is just so much wrong here I don't even know where to begin. It's especially dismaying that a site labelling itself 'rational' is in fact anything but - and that people appear to be reading it and taking it seriously as a source.

doodledragon I've heard rumours that after the last episodes are shown on Netflix, the makers are looking to get funding and distribution though a porn company, so the stereotyping might get a little more extreme.

Actually, (gah, look what you made me do mn!) I've just remembered an early scene. The trans character has broken the cotton ceiling and is being introduced to her girl friend's lesbian friends (aka butch terfs) and they want nothing to do with her. They don't name terfs but it's clear you're not in 'their gang' (the main 8 characters who you are led to be drawn to and admire) if you don't accept the relationship.

I'll watch so you don't have to.

But, I really wouldn't have had a clue about all this a couple of years ago. I do thank mn for my ongoing education. However, there will be as many people who don't understand subliminal messages.

^^ I'm not sure I like what I've written above, I think it could offend? I think what I want to say is that there is comment about a group of lesbians not accepting the relationship between a trans woman and a lesbian, and they're depicted as unsavoury and narrow minded.

and they're depicted as unsavoury and narrow minded.

They always are. Also they have penis envy, are really transmen in denial and are only lesbians because they can't get a man.

I've said this before, but some of the most perfect exchanges I've seen are between enraged TRAs and lesbians. The men simply can't comprehend how all their normal insults, gaslighting, threats and entreaties fall entirely on the fallowist of fallow ground possible.

It's awesome.

It always seems to be lesbians that have to examine their sexuality. Where are the storylines criticising gay men for not sleeping with ftt, or straight men for not rushing to date mtt?

BigDeskBob

Exactly. Men don't care. Because...men don't have to.

This is the most perfect analysis of the woman vs trans position.

What really made me take a breath was the empathy of the writer. It's undeniable. What makes it so comprehensive is, it's the irrefutable truth.

docs.google.com/document/d/17D0BbPGJrh2029l0bSDSUaEx-KTsmo6ZmrjDQly5LlY/mobilebasic

Ah well, a gay man turns down a straight woman in the show too.

I had a recent bruising online encounter with some young "feminists" about gender neutral pronouns in pro-choice campaigns. Really terrifying how abusive and closed-minded they were and how ignorant they were of actual feminist history. They are graduates and many honestly could not string together an argument

Yes I had a trans male ranting and tutting at 'lesbian separatism' on twitter today. He didn't like my replies re the age old thing about males thinking they are allowed sexual access to lesbians so he blocked me

What's amusing is that they just come out with all manner of shite and expect you to say, 'uh duh, ok then'. Including picking me up for my use of language. These fuckers actually tell me how I am to express myself and dictate what is considered offensive ('transing', apparently, is offensive). And yet they write web pages justifying the use of TERF and expect me to comply. Ha ha ha

He didn't like my replies re the age old thing about males thinking they are allowed sexual access to lesbians so he blocked me grin

They think they are reinventing the wheel. They have no idea, that lesbians have had to put up with this shit for years. Lesbians find it tedious in the extreme.

These men really dislike being reminded not only of quite how male they are, but that what they are saying is unrelentingly old news.

What's amusing is that they just come out with all manner of shite and expect you to say, 'uh duh, ok then'.

Yeah, never ceases to amaze me. They're like Jack Chick (If you have never heard of Chick Tracts, google them, they're hilarious. Some sort of evangelical Christian propaganda and really, really bad), expecting that you a) have never heard the misogynist drivel they spout before and b) will be immediately converted by the threat of eternal damnation being ostracised by misogynists.

It never seems to enter their mind (at first) that you might have already heard their idiotic ideology and just chosen not to believe it/be virtually unable to believe it even if you wanted. Because it is illogical nonsense.

Granted, unlike with Jesus, some people genuinely never have heard transpropaganda, but in feminist circles, the likelihood of this is fast approaching zero.

I went to a top university to do my masters last year, out of interest, and my discipline, I took a feminist module. It almost broke me, I've never felt so silenced and shocked....the class was about women, for women but it frowned upon women's rights as doing 'literal violence' whatever the fuck that means, to other groups.

We had a trans woman come in to lecture us on the female penis and female sperm.

In a university? On an actual course? Oh my fucking God.

Yep, Russell Group - sociology masters module.

lesbians have had to put up with this shit for years. Lesbians find it tedious in the extreme

The problem is AFAIK some lesbians are swayed by this shit. They think they are being transphobic, and focused on genitals rather than personalities. They question their lesbianism, and whether they are in fact transmen.

The amount of damage the TRAs cause to young gay/lesbians is

It always seems to be lesbians that have to examine their sexuality. Where are the storylines criticising gay men for not sleeping with ftt, or straight men for not rushing to date mtt?

Because they know that hell will freeze over before straight men accept that they have some sort of obligation to consider people with cocks as sexual partners. They think it might be easier to bully women into it.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine

Yes, I think the lesbians (and non-lesbians) on gendertrender are older, and made of stern stuff. They frequently lament the plight of younger gay women who are gaslighted.

This seems an appropriate spot to leave this

www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/scottish-news/1492364/tiffany-scott-andrew-burns-prisoner-dangerous/

ginger
Literal violence. Paris Lees should write an article about that individual - how they should be in a prison for women perhaps.
They gets misgendered and everything the poor little flower.

The only comment under that article said 'don't insult women by referring to (him) as she'.

A sentiment I wholeheartedly endorse.

What an animal.

I wonder if TRAs would say about someone like that?
I imagine they might say they're not really trans.
By they can't say that can they?

"Four years ago, she also admitted stalking a 13-year-old girl by sending her letters from her cell at Polmont Prison, near Falkirk."

I don't understand why newspapers refer to these men as women when the courts refer to them as men.

BigDeskBob

There was a thread about that a while ago. It's something to do with the protocols when reporting, where you can't call a transwoman a man unless it's completely pertinent to the story.

Constantly pretending that this sort of behaviour is female, is pretty bloody pertinent, as far as I'm concerned.